I bet the majority of local people would have preferred to see the square keep its original, historic, name. Am I allowed to express that opinion, or will it be deleted like all the other posts that disagree with this whole idea ?

I bet the majority of local people would have preferred to see the square keep its original, historic, name. Am I allowed to express that opinion, or will it be deleted like all the other posts that disagree with this whole idea ?

I have been reliably informed that the square was only named after Hawkin in the 80's and actually it was named Palace Square before. In any case the name change to Leslie is something which I support.

I bet the majority of local people would have preferred to see the square keep its original, historic, name. Am I allowed to express that opinion, or will it be deleted like all the other posts that disagree with this whole idea ?

No posts have been deleted on this thread other than those that break the Pasoti Agreement re racism.

Try engaging brain before hitting the submit button eh?

You have a PM.

I bet the majority of local people would have preferred to see the square keep its original, historic, name. Am I allowed to express that opinion, or will it be deleted like all the other posts that disagree with this whole idea ?

No posts have been deleted on this thread other than those that break the Pasoti Agreement re racism.

Try engaging brain before hitting the submit button eh?

You have a PM.

The posts that were deleted (including mine) were moved to the Terraces where they can still be viewed. By no stretch of the imagination could my comments be construed as racist. You advise me to "try engaging brain before hitting the submit button". I advise you to do the same, especially if you are making accusations.

Your PM threatens me with being banned, which is entirely up to you. However, this is either a discussion forum or it is not. Do not be surprised if people disagree with some of the comments on this board. Not long ago, you were encouraging people to post on PASOTI. This may be an example of why some are relucant to do so.

You have said your bit and I've said mine. So lets just leave it at that.

No I won’t.

So you claim posts have been deleted and now you claimed they were moved, which is it?

We only deleted the racist stuff. As your’s was moved it obviously wasn’t.

Note the words ‘deleted’ and ‘moved’

Do you not see the points made?

Anyone can object to what is being said, but racism of any sort will NOT be tolerated.

My PRIVATE message to you explained if you undermine the Mods by lying you would be banned for a period of time.

“Undermining moderators by lying” ? Are you quite sure about that ?

I see that you have moved this post away from your your main discussion board.

It seems to me that PASOTI is becoming a forum for a relatively small cliche of people to agree with each other. If you keep editIng discussion threads with the intention of suppressing alternative viewpoints then its not a genuine discussion.

There is clearly an element of your readership who don't agree with this re-naming of the square. But just about every dissenting comment has been deleted, moved, hidden (however you wish to describe it) from the main discussion thread. These posts are not racist or offensive, they are simply in disagreement.

The result is that you have created a distorted picture, making it looks like everyone agrees with you. I know its your website, but what is the point of that ?

Am I allowed to express that opinion, or will it be deleted like all the other posts that disagree with this whole idea ?

That's not a lie then?

I would think that at the end of the day when all this political correctness over what is racism or what is not dies down.....and all this knee jerking response to what happened to an Afro-American thousands of miles from here gets looked at in the light of day....one might spare a moment to wonder what Jack Leslie's thought about it all.

I would think that he would be highly embarrassed that a Square in Plymouth suddenly get renamed in his honour years after his passing.... because of what some knuckle dragging thick American white cop saw as doing his duty.

I would think that at the end of the day when all this political correctness over what is racism or what is not dies down.....and all this knee jerking response to what happened to an Afro-American thousands of miles from here gets looked at in the light of day....one might spare a moment to wonder what Jack Leslie's thought about it all.

I would think that he would be highly embarrassed that a Square in Plymouth suddenly get renamed in his honour years after his passing.... because of what some knuckle dragging thick American white cop saw as doing his duty.

Well, members of his family aren't embarrassed.
But good that you have a clear knowledge of his thought process.
How far back does your telepathy go? I mean, can you tell us if John Hawkins would be embarrassed to have a square named after himself 400 years after his passing?

I bet the majority of local people would have preferred to see the square keep its original, historic, name. Am I allowed to express that opinion, or will it be deleted like all the other posts that disagree with this whole idea ?

You mean its original, 'historic' name, given to it in the historic 1980s?
I'm quite surprised, since supposedly in the historic 1980s ideas of slavery, kidnap and murder were somewhat frowned upon, that none of the Hawkins fan club are asking why, as recently as the historic 80s, did we think it was suitable to honour someone who enslaved, kidnapped and murdered, given that by then we knew those things were, you know, sort of bad? Unless of course, you think that in the historic 1980s it was appropriate to name a square after someone who did that sort of thing?
It'd be a bit like town planners in Berlin, in 2020, proposing to name a street Hitler Strasse and the Berlin equivalent of Lunarjetman saying 'well, if we don't call it Hitler Strasse we're airbrushing our history'.

You still havent answered whether you'd be happy with an explanatory panel in the square saying that it was formerly known as Hawkins Square, and that he had been a slaver who killed thousands of people....
Or would that be too much history? I mean at least with the street name and no info about Hawkins no-one actually has to learn what a grade A horror he was?

Its become impossible to keep up with this disucssion because the original thread (which was a single thread on the main board) has been split up into 3 or 4 separate threads. Its had the effect of hiding most of the comments opposed to the re-naming of the Square and bringing most attention to the comments supporting the re-naming.

My main point is that PASOTI is either a discussuion board or it isn't. Editing out offensive or libelous content, or keeping some sort of order to the postings is reasonable. But it seems to me that the Jack Leslie Square topic was edited in a manner that supressed any opinion that didn't agree with the idea. And I don't think that's fair play.

Anyhow, that's my "problem with moderating" which IJN, not for the first time, has got his knickers a twist about.
Just my personal opinion, of course.

Topic closed as far as I am concerned. See you on the main board if I'm not banned as a result of such naughtiness.