Mike Dean

DenverDugout · Feb 8, 2021

I am interested what you think of his recent episode of sending players off which when viewed later have seen to be wrong. I think that MOTD pundits should not use there priveleged positions to berate referees, I also think that players need to take resposibility, diving, holding and going over clutching there head etc when there is no injury. He got both decisions wrong but that does not in anyway justify death threats etc and those responsible should be done for it. The brains that dream up some of the current rules etc also have no idea what it is like to both officiate and play in some of these fever pitch games. I have officiated in officiating professional players and it is no easy task especially when there managers adopt such aggressive attitudes also.

Pogleswoody · Feb 8, 2021

charlieboy":1empipsp said:
I am interested what you think of his recent episode of sending players off which when viewed later have seen to be wrong. I think that MOTD pundits should not use there priveleged positions to berate referees, I also think that players need to take resposibility, diving, holding and going over clutching there head etc when there is no injury. He got both decisions wrong but that does not in anyway justify death threats etc and those responsible should be done for it. The brains that dream up some of the current rules etc also have no idea what it is like to both officiate and play in some of these fever pitch games. I have officiated in officiating professional players and it is no easy task especially when there managers adopt such aggressive attitudes also.

Wasn't he told repeatedly by the 'victim' that there was no deliberate elbow? Did he not prefer the judgement of a guy who wasn't there and a screenshot over the pro footballer's opinion? :think:

Lobster · Feb 8, 2021

We can debate for hours about how VAR or social media are to blame for the recent hysteria. However, I think the only way that we will get past abuse of referees, and more generally the discussion over right or wrong decisions (which has been exacerbated by VAR even if it gets more "correct" decisions), is for the media not to discuss referee performance at all.

I know this is a radical move from the status quo, but if there was no discussion on TV or in the press, then fans would not get so riled up by it and most would have forgotten about it an hour after the final whistle.

Of course, the media outlets will do anything to increase viewership so there is fat chance of this happening. But when death threats are flying around for a decision that had zero effect on the game, then a line needs to be drawn.

Nobby · Feb 8, 2021

Lobster":1cumeztr said:
We can debate for hours about how VAR or social media are to blame for the recent hysteria. However, I think the only way that we will get past abuse of referees, and more generally the discussion over right or wrong decisions (which has been exacerbated by VAR even if it gets more "correct" decisions), is for the media not to discuss referee performance at all.

I know this is a radical move from the status quo, but if there was no discussion on TV or in the press, then fans would not get so riled up by it and most would have forgotten about it an hour after the final whistle.

Of course, the media outlets will do anything to increase viewership so there is fat chance of this happening. But when death threats are flying around for a decision that had zero effect on the game, then a line needs to be drawn.

Fans care that the ref doesn’t screw their team over, not what Gary Lineker has to say about it.

The way to improve refereeing is to make the referees accountable, just like any other employee would be in a regular job. Mike Dean made three horrendous decisions in a row and would still be refereeing in the premier league next week if it wasn’t the death threats (which I do not condone). That’s completely unacceptable by any standard.

Referee’s should be mic’d up. We should be able to hear what they say to the players, what they discuss with VAR. If fans could see rational decision making the fury over these decisions would be far, far less. But right now we don’t. We see some bloke at Stockley Park drawing lines and watching everything in slo mo to find the most incriminating freeze frame. It’s a complete shambles.

EyeOpener · Feb 8, 2021

Lobster":zw6uhuy6 said:
We can debate for hours about how VAR or social media are to blame for the recent hysteria. However, I think the only way that we will get past abuse of referees, and more generally the discussion over right or wrong decisions (which has been exacerbated by VAR even if it gets more "correct" decisions), is for the media not to discuss referee performance at all.

I know this is a radical move from the status quo, but if there was no discussion on TV or in the press, then fans would not get so riled up by it and most would have forgotten about it an hour after the final whistle.

Of course, the media outlets will do anything to increase viewership so there is fat chance of this happening. But when death threats are flying around for a decision that had zero effect on the game, then a line needs to be drawn.

Definitely. I've never been a fan of VAR. I think that the only technology we should have in football is goal line technology. Simply a way of telling if the ball was over the line or not. The way things are at the moment, you could argue that we don't need officials anymore. To have goals disallowed because a players toe or hand is offside is absolutely stupid. In the recent case of Soucek being sent off, it seems that Mike Deans first response was to not issue a red card as I guess he didn't deem it a red but his instinct was questioned and VAR introduced an element of doubt into his initial decision which has ultimately swayed him. Just get back to having the ref and linesman calling the shots on the field. If there is any doubt on whether a ball crossed a line then bring in the tech.

ealinggreen · Feb 8, 2021

I have no problems with referees, it is the players who are the problem. They cheat endlessly and then complain when a ref gets it wrong. Mark Lawrenson summed it up when he said the player left his leg there the striker had the excuse to find it. If a player is intent on cheating how can you blame a ref, sometimes cheats will win.Refs do there best and are honest, On the other hand players cheat endlessly and are revered for it.Refs cannot win.

Chicago Green · Feb 8, 2021

I have a lot of respect for refs, even though their decisions often infuriate me. Players and management of both teams acting aggressively towards the ref is just part of the game, and they do so well not to react to some of the abuse they get. Being able to hear the way that players and staff spoke to the referee at Pompey on Saturday makes you wonder why anyone would do it.

greensalt · Feb 8, 2021

ealinggreen":21u6kzha said:
I have no problems with referees, it is the players who are the problem. They cheat endlessly and then complain when a ref gets it wrong. Mark Lawrenson summed it up when he said the player left his leg there the striker had the excuse to find it. If a player is intent on cheating how can you blame a ref, sometimes cheats will win.Refs do there best and are honest, On the other hand players cheat endlessly and are revered for it.Refs cannot win.

Agreed. Like Salah's ridiculous fall when he felt a hand on his shoulder - and certainly not for the first time. If he'd been genuinely pulled back, fair enough, but he could have stayed on his feet.

Time for retrospective bans for those caught cheating by the cameras.

Hores Everywhere · Feb 8, 2021

I thought the soucek sending off was a complete lack of common sense by Dean. I may be wrong but I got the impression he was called over to look at the incident by VAR and not a case of VAR recommending a red. It was not an intentional raised hand but an accidental coming together which Dean should have ignored and told the players to get on with it. Pleased to see the red has been rescinded.

Re the threats, totally uncalled for and I hope the calls for social media companies to take more responsibility is acted on.

Alan Turing · Feb 8, 2021

Referees have a devil of a job, that’s not open to question.

They should be respected.

However, they should be held accountable when they make a howler, and not seemingly untouchable.

Lobster · Feb 8, 2021

I agree with those that say refs should be held accountable. But this should be done internally, like in almost every other job. It does not need to be trial by media, which is what causes all this hysteria and abuse.

It also makes watching the games incredibly boring. I much prefer watching games without VAR than with it. I believe the stats say that VAR has led to more "correct" decisions. If so, I would prefer VAR decisions to be made behind closed doors, not scrutinised as they're happening. It's mind numbing. That will never happen though, so the next best thing is probably to make it more transparent with miked up refs.

Quintrell Green · Feb 8, 2021

What I find odd in these controversial VAR incidents is that the ref alone is the one, who is left to view the TV pitchside monitor. I would have thought it beneficial to all parties, for a linesman, the fourth official, and the ref to all to take a view at the same time and for the final decision to be the best of the three. This could very easily be arranged without taking up excessive time, whilst taking some of the media heat off the ref alone.

Lev Yashin · Feb 8, 2021

Having played coached and refereed I feel that I have a reasonable handle on the game of Football.
From the very first day of the introduction of VAR I have the opinion that now we have 5 officials to make a decision instead of 1.
Then you get results like in the West Ham game ,total rubbish on a constant basis .
The powers that be are making millions from the sale,and implementation of this technology with very little thought given to the reality.
The games with VAR are now slowed down losing the excitement of the moment.
The offside rule is a shambles why have a linesman if he has to wait 15/25 seconds before putting the flag up and also not make the offside decision but wait for a line declaring that a toenail was .
The ideal solution is get rid of VAR and everyone believe that the referee will occasionally get it wrong just like in the lower divisions and live with it.

Not going to happen to much money changing hands behind the scenes :coat:
Just enjoy watching a real football game at Plymouth Argyle !

DenverDugout · Feb 9, 2021

Some very interesting views, I think VAR is wrong although if we recall it was the managers saying the ref got it wrong and calling for Var, Now, even though they got what they wanted it is still wrong. The amount of money in the Premier league is obscene and only leads to extra pressure being put on managers etc as the cost of losing is too great. For me one of the pleasures of football was debating the decisions in the pub on a Saturday night, was it a penalty or not or should he have been sent off was what made the game so enjoyable, a bit like the different opinions on this site.

taunton pilgrim · Feb 9, 2021

Football will never be the same again now VAR as been introduced. Fans can't even celebrate a goal untill VAR deems it legal. Getting to the stage I don't enjoy watching matches now. Just have goal line technology, that's all we need.

Mike Dean

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