A great post and all, as far as I can see, difficult to argue with Graham. My concern though is what the wider population in Plymouth think about Argyle. We already know that the overwhelming majority of the local poulation have little interest in the club and that is the problem the Council will need to address if they want to push through this political hot potato.
At the end of the day, are there any votes in it?

The sad thing seems to be that trotting out the old line "you must all get behind this deal or the club will die" is having less and less of a threatening effect on fans, especially us older ones, as it is feeling more and more that the club (as we knew and loved it) is already dead. I for one take no pleasure in feeling this way, but it is a true statement.

[Argylegames]

Graham's post above should be a prominent article in The Herald.

I am not naive enough to expect the local 'news'paper to print it even if they received it.

A great post and all, as far as I can see, difficult to argue with Graham. My concern though is what the wider population in Plymouth think about Argyle. We already know that the overwhelming majority of the local poulation have little interest in the club and that is the problem the Council will need to address if they want to push through this political hot potato.
At the end of the day, are there any votes in it?

As I've said before, it depends how the Council present it to the public. If its put in such a way as Graham has done here (brilliant post by the way!), then it's very difficult to argue against it, even for someone who has no interest in Argyle.

Irresepctive of that, I think you underestimate the interest of the local population. There's a big difference between being an apahetic Janner when it comes to attending games, and being someone who couldn't give a damn if the club folds. I know people who have very little interest in Argyle, but they would certainly not want to see the club fold and would back the Council stepping in to help save the club.

I have said it before, and I will say it again - I am totally amazed at the seemingly lethargic attitude of the local media on this issue.

The only news that comes out of them seems to be stuff that I have already read on PASOTI.

I have said it before, and I will say it again - I am totally amazed at the seemingly lethargic attitude of the local media on this issue.

The only news that comes out of them seems to be stuff that I have already read on PASOTI.

I wonder what ever happened to investigative journalism? As opposed to cut n paste from a press conference?

This Story is a chance for a local reporter to really make his name in his profession. It has it all - Lies, Double Crossing, Backstabbing and spurious Busines dealings linked to Offshore Companies.
If you were the Journo who blew this wide open I think you would be headhunted by a top national paper or media company.

Graham Clark also wrote some months back:

"However, for me at this time, when the football club were facing closure in 1996 the Exeter City Council stepped forward and bought the freehold of St James Park from Beazer Homes (the developers the club had previously sold too). Yes, they saw the bigger picture. No political suicide here. The rest they say is history and now they are a model we are looking to emulate.

I don't know about you but I don't think I could cope with the fact that Exeter City Council were prepared to assist in saving their football league club and Plymouth City Council were not prepared to do the very same. I would want retribution, I really would."

What politician would be comfortable in letting the club disappear? It would be catastrophic for their own political careers and their support base would be instantly eroded. Of course, just like in Exeter, there will be many in the city who would oppose money be given to bail out the football club, but the level of opposition and passion would be nothing like if they were to let it die.

The real issue is that PCC can't be seen to be bailing out failed businessmen or assisting shady, anonymous chancers. If it was the Supporters Trust (as in ECFC's case) who assumed control of the football club, PCC could assist as everything would be ethical, above board and it would be seen as asset to the community.

The council, despite some bravado from opposition group leaders over the years, has consistently failed to grasp the big issues for Plymouth, as they are scared of the electorate. The turnouts at council elections are sometimes so dismal, that it is the popular issues (tinside etc) that can effect vote swings of just hundreds that are needed to change the balance of power. I am always amazed to see how small the majorities needed are to change from tory to labour and vice versa on the back of Daily Mail-reading/Taxpayers Alliance-supporting indignation and short termism.

This will only change if:
1. A ruling party is willing to take action for the good of the city even if it means they lose power.
2. All parties are agreed on a certain controversial course of action for the good of the city (not discounting UKIP and BNP of course,who will use any wedge to get their Goebelsesque view across)
3. There is a credible alternative political force to pressurise a decision (i.e. loads of argyle fans standing as independents and drawing on support from all parties, even ones they have supported for years)
4. A visionary/charismatic elected mayor

I applaud all the PASOTIites that have come up with empassioned pleas to save the club and creative ideas for ways forward. It shows that solutions are out there. I am however, as a Plymothian, dubious that our elected representatives have the cojones, creativity or innovative spirit to step up to the plate for Argyle at this time.

I do not wish to speak for or misrepresent Peter Jones or James Brent for that matter, but from their past involvements they would privately (if not publicly) agree that a spirit of enterprise may now exist at the University, but not necessarily in the council chambers.

-

The sad thing seems to be that trotting out the old line "you must all get behind this deal or the club will die" is having less and less of a threatening effect on fans, especially us older ones, as it is feeling more and more that the club (as we knew and loved it) is already dead. I for one take no pleasure in feeling this way, but it is a true statement.

FJ,

That was said to us last week at the Fan's Alliance meeting and to say we reacted, as one, to it, was an understatement.

I'm truly amazed they're still trying that tack, as it was obvious (or I thought it was) what the normal fan thinks of such scare tactics.

In the broader discussion of Local Government support for city based football clubs, there is an interesting piece in The Times today re. Liverpool FC. Liverpool City Council to their great credit pulled in £8.2M from the EEC to help the Club start in its' progress towards moving to a new 60,000 seater stand in Stanley Park. The Council Leader is seeking the return of the money as the Club have not as yet been firm in their decision to move from Anfield.

I appreciate that their levels of poverty and a greater need for regeneration in parts of Liverpool than perhaps parts of Plymouth, but I just wonder if there are grant opportunities in Europe, which could help PAFC's wider cause at this moment? My only concern would relate to 'matched funding' but I would hope that something could available for a site close to difficult Devonport.

This TINA thing that seems to rumble on and on..... There comes a point when it becomes true. It is nearly always down to timescale or lack of options.

I agree that the other options are certainly there to explore but as this plan B only got off the ground a couple of days ago it really has to be said that there is no time to get it all into place. The main reason being for that is lack of money. Obviously Mr Brent is at the meeting on Friday and he is the main source of that but he does not strike me as a man who is willing to gamble. The current debts at the club are huge and somebody has to clear them. There are still to many ifs and buts in any alternative plan and the stakes are high.

I still believe the best alternative is to get this deal through and support the club. THEN, we start negotiation.

I am confident that we as a club can raise over 10 million per annum and at the same time liberate football clubs at all levels and revoloutionalise the sporting world by raising millions
more for all sports. I am also confident that we as a club can influence a trend that will place sports clubs back at the hub of communities, helping to revitalise local economy and independent businesses.

I want Plymouth Argyle to be at the forefront of this and this downturn in our fortunes could actually be the beginning of something really special.

I really want and need the club to survive, it's part of my life and I can't be without it.