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Derek Adams at Senior Greens

May 8, 2011
5,788
793
Forest of Dean Green":2t009gjl said:
plymouthboyuk":2t009gjl said:
What I will say about Derek Adams is that his public persona, is totally different to what you see at meetings like Senior Greens. He invited questions, cracked the odd joke, and was overwhelmingly appreciated by those present. I think it fair to say, many Managers in Argyles predicament, would have made an excuse not to appear. No matter what he does, those who dislike him will never change. I went to the meeting with a friend who was not a great fan of Derek Adams, and he said to me after the meeting, ā€œ I have a totally different opinion about Derek Adams after todayā€. Itā€™s a pity some of his very vocal distractors were not there today.

I have no doubt this is true. But itā€™s not a personality contest. Itā€™s the fact we are staring into the abyss after an appalling season that makes people detractors. People can cope with a chippy public persona when we are winning. They may even welcome it. But when we are so, so poor. Well it just seems petulant. Which begs the question, if he can be much more diplomatic, open, likeable and relaxed, why does he not show that side more often publically? Why does he appear to be so defensive when, at the moment, he really needs to build goodwill. Itā€™s a problem of his own making. He could do with some help in that regard, and maybe the club should be providing it if they, as many suspect, have no intention of sacking him.

How Adams was today day is how he is publically.
 

davie nine

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Jan 23, 2015
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Metal_Green_Mickey":16jbjxnk said:
davie nine":16jbjxnk said:
Ruben Lameiras received his Senior Greens Player of the Season award and thanked us. On behalf the team he assured us that they would all be fully committed to the next 2 games.
ā€˜Key playersā€™ doubtful are Letheren and Ladapo. No point in concealing when it was revealed to 200+ Senior Greens.
DA accepts full responsibility for playing matters this season and for the previous 3 seasons. He encouraged members to ask questions by saying ā€œCome on, give it a goā€ when there was a brief pause in questioning.
Our playing budget was 5th lowest in our league last season per EFL. Current season not known yet.
Admitted that defence has not been compact enough and was particularly disappointed with conceding late goals recently against Bristol Rovers and Blackpool.
Also, concerned that, apart from Ladapo, Lameiras and Carey other midfielders had not contributed with goals. Joel Grantā€™s injury was a major blow as he was having a good season.
He explained attempts to resolve problems with Herald before the ban was decided necessary.
Following this meeting, I am not changing my pro Adams stance. I assume that MGM, rsp4 and oldage were not there to ask questions as I am sure that he would have been prepared to answer their questions frankly.

The way this thread has turned out proves it is right not to go.

You went there and enjoyed it. You liked what he said. Why would l go to change a ā€œpositiveā€ atmosphere for you, and l dare say many others that were there at the meeting.

Iā€™m afraid l have listened to him over and over again. What you have to remember Davie is that for me the game and style Adams talks about isnā€™t the football l witness.

Iā€™m afraid to me all he telling people is excuses. For example, at the end of last season we were one of the lowest goal scoring teams away from home. We knew Ness, Fox and Sarcevic didnā€™t contribute enough goals over a year ago. Today he is telling you there arenā€™t enough goals coming from midfield. Well ....sorry...but ya Duh!!! A year one that midfield, if itā€™s injury free is still our first choice along with Songoā€™o. 12 months on and now he is telling people itā€™s an issue. Surely, this performance/statistical bloke Adams has was pointing this out last season.

Thatā€™s just one issue. There are so many more.

Does any remember Holloway era. Brilliant talker. Green blood...and all that nonsense. ...as a fan base we loved him. It was just words. He left when a better opportunity came along. Holloway and Adams are educated, bright people. When they talk itā€™s bound to sound good. However, as l learnt with Holloway itā€™s just sound bites.

Actions speak louder than words.

So l judge Adams not what he says, but what l see on the pitch. And what l see on the pitch isnā€™t good. At least Holloway could back up his fancy talk by his team performing on the pitch.

Glad you think he is the right bloke but for me if we end up in league 2 l think thatā€™s the only FACT thatā€™s points to Adams, Wotton and Nancekivell being the wrong people to take Argyle forward. It will be four years wasted.
As I have said before, Mickey, I do respect your opinion.
I would add that he was asked about his alleged tactics of being too defensive. His response was to ask how he can be accused of that when he includes Carey, Ladapo and Lameiras in the same team.
Thatā€™s why I wish that you were there to challenge him on this as the questioner didnā€™t.
I guess one argument would be that he didnā€™t use Lameiras regularly until January. He did mention Joel Grant who was playing well in an attacking role and keeping Lameiras out until his unfortunate injury.
Incidentally, I suspect that he may leave Lameiras out of the starting line up on Saturday. I would be disappointed if that happened but if he did that and we won I would be delighted.
 

Forest of Dean Green

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Mar 5, 2009
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HC Green":3hjuqzi7 said:
Forest of Dean Green":3hjuqzi7 said:
plymouthboyuk":3hjuqzi7 said:
What I will say about Derek Adams is that his public persona, is totally different to what you see at meetings like Senior Greens. He invited questions, cracked the odd joke, and was overwhelmingly appreciated by those present. I think it fair to say, many Managers in Argyles predicament, would have made an excuse not to appear. No matter what he does, those who dislike him will never change. I went to the meeting with a friend who was not a great fan of Derek Adams, and he said to me after the meeting, ā€œ I have a totally different opinion about Derek Adams after todayā€. Itā€™s a pity some of his very vocal distractors were not there today.

I have no doubt this is true. But itā€™s not a personality contest. Itā€™s the fact we are staring into the abyss after an appalling season that makes people detractors. People can cope with a chippy public persona when we are winning. They may even welcome it. But when we are so, so poor. Well it just seems petulant. Which begs the question, if he can be much more diplomatic, open, likeable and relaxed, why does he not show that side more often publically? Why does he appear to be so defensive when, at the moment, he really needs to build goodwill. Itā€™s a problem of his own making. He could do with some help in that regard, and maybe the club should be providing it if they, as many suspect, have no intention of sacking him.

How Adams was today day is how he is publically.

Really? Do you listen to his patronising and chippy post match interviews with the media? Or do you not hear them as I hear them? And I recall his previous criticisms of fans. I think his public persona is pretty poor - at least that that which he expresses via the media. I donā€™t doubt that in these fan forums he comes over well, or that he is a decent enough man, but Iā€™m not at them when I live 200 miles away. He needs to work on his broader communication style and media presence, because thatā€™s the way many fans experience him. Particularly when things arenā€™t going well.
 
May 8, 2011
5,788
793
Forest of Dean Green":3kf41m33 said:
HC Green":3kf41m33 said:
Forest of Dean Green":3kf41m33 said:
plymouthboyuk":3kf41m33 said:
What I will say about Derek Adams is that his public persona, is totally different to what you see at meetings like Senior Greens. He invited questions, cracked the odd joke, and was overwhelmingly appreciated by those present. I think it fair to say, many Managers in Argyles predicament, would have made an excuse not to appear. No matter what he does, those who dislike him will never change. I went to the meeting with a friend who was not a great fan of Derek Adams, and he said to me after the meeting, ā€œ I have a totally different opinion about Derek Adams after todayā€. Itā€™s a pity some of his very vocal distractors were not there today.

I have no doubt this is true. But itā€™s not a personality contest. Itā€™s the fact we are staring into the abyss after an appalling season that makes people detractors. People can cope with a chippy public persona when we are winning. They may even welcome it. But when we are so, so poor. Well it just seems petulant. Which begs the question, if he can be much more diplomatic, open, likeable and relaxed, why does he not show that side more often publically? Why does he appear to be so defensive when, at the moment, he really needs to build goodwill. Itā€™s a problem of his own making. He could do with some help in that regard, and maybe the club should be providing it if they, as many suspect, have no intention of sacking him.

How Adams was today day is how he is publically.

Really? Do you listen to his patronising and chippy post match interviews with the media? Or do you not hear them as I hear them? And I recall his previous criticisms of fans. I think his public persona is pretty poor - at least that that which he expresses via the media. I donā€™t doubt that in these fan forums he comes over well, or that he is a decent enough man, but Iā€™m not at them when I live 200 miles away. He needs to work on his broader communication style and media presence, because thatā€™s the way many fans experience him. Particularly when things arenā€™t going well.

Iā€™ve never heard one of his post match interviews apart from the clips on GOS and they seem fine by me.
 
Sep 6, 2006
16,431
3,967
davie nine":3r19mw57 said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":3r19mw57 said:
davie nine":3r19mw57 said:
Ruben Lameiras received his Senior Greens Player of the Season award and thanked us. On behalf the team he assured us that they would all be fully committed to the next 2 games.
ā€˜Key playersā€™ doubtful are Letheren and Ladapo. No point in concealing when it was revealed to 200+ Senior Greens.
DA accepts full responsibility for playing matters this season and for the previous 3 seasons. He encouraged members to ask questions by saying ā€œCome on, give it a goā€ when there was a brief pause in questioning.
Our playing budget was 5th lowest in our league last season per EFL. Current season not known yet.
Admitted that defence has not been compact enough and was particularly disappointed with conceding late goals recently against Bristol Rovers and Blackpool.
Also, concerned that, apart from Ladapo, Lameiras and Carey other midfielders had not contributed with goals. Joel Grantā€™s injury was a major blow as he was having a good season.
He explained attempts to resolve problems with Herald before the ban was decided necessary.
Following this meeting, I am not changing my pro Adams stance. I assume that MGM, rsp4 and oldage were not there to ask questions as I am sure that he would have been prepared to answer their questions frankly.

The way this thread has turned out proves it is right not to go.

You went there and enjoyed it. You liked what he said. Why would l go to change a ā€œpositiveā€ atmosphere for you, and l dare say many others that were there at the meeting.

Iā€™m afraid l have listened to him over and over again. What you have to remember Davie is that for me the game and style Adams talks about isnā€™t the football l witness.

Iā€™m afraid to me all he telling people is excuses. For example, at the end of last season we were one of the lowest goal scoring teams away from home. We knew Ness, Fox and Sarcevic didnā€™t contribute enough goals over a year ago. Today he is telling you there arenā€™t enough goals coming from midfield. Well ....sorry...but ya Duh!!! A year one that midfield, if itā€™s injury free is still our first choice along with Songoā€™o. 12 months on and now he is telling people itā€™s an issue. Surely, this performance/statistical bloke Adams has was pointing this out last season.

Thatā€™s just one issue. There are so many more.

Does any remember Holloway era. Brilliant talker. Green blood...and all that nonsense. ...as a fan base we loved him. It was just words. He left when a better opportunity came along. Holloway and Adams are educated, bright people. When they talk itā€™s bound to sound good. However, as l learnt with Holloway itā€™s just sound bites.

Actions speak louder than words.

So l judge Adams not what he says, but what l see on the pitch. And what l see on the pitch isnā€™t good. At least Holloway could back up his fancy talk by his team performing on the pitch.

Glad you think he is the right bloke but for me if we end up in league 2 l think thatā€™s the only FACT thatā€™s points to Adams, Wotton and Nancekivell being the wrong people to take Argyle forward. It will be four years wasted.
As I have said before, Mickey, I do respect your opinion.
I would add that he was asked about his alleged tactics of being too defensive. His response was to ask how he can be accused of that when he includes Carey, Ladapo and Lameiras in the same team.
Thatā€™s why I wish that you were there to challenge him on this as the questioner didnā€™t.
I guess one argument would be that he didnā€™t use Lameiras regularly until January. He did mention Joel Grant who was playing well in an attacking role and keeping Lameiras out until his unfortunate injury.
Incidentally, I suspect that he may leave Lameiras out of the starting line up on Saturday. I would be disappointed if that happened but if he did that and we won I would be delighted.

Was that seriously his argument? That he couldnt be considered defensive because he plays THREE attacking players. And two of those hardly ever get across the half way line away from home.
 

demportdave

šŸŒ Bomber Harris.
Jul 6, 2005
3,750
1,534
plymouthboyuk":tm981i9z said:
What I will say about Derek Adams is that his public persona, is totally different to what you see at meetings like Senior Greens. He invited questions, cracked the odd joke, and was overwhelmingly appreciated by those present. I think it fair to say, many Managers in Argyles predicament, would have made an excuse not to appear. No matter what he does, those who dislike him will never change. I went to the meeting with a friend who was not a great fan of Derek Adams, and he said to me after the meeting, ā€œ I have a totally different opinion about Derek Adams after todayā€. Itā€™s a pity some of his very vocal distractors were not there today.
Adams is the Manager of our very badly performing football team, not a guest on a chat show. I couldnā€™t care less if he is charm personified or Mr Nasty, that is completely irrelevant in the overall scheme of things. Iā€™m not interested in any Manager on a personal level, my view of him is based purely on how he manages my team.

I suspect that the view of your friend ā€œwho was not a great fan of Derek Adamsā€ was based on his poor performance as the Manager this season, the dour 1-dimensional football, the lack of tactical nous to change the course of a game in the way Lovell did for Gillingham and the defensive mindset of sitting back on 1-goal leads for 4 seasons.

But after a pleasant and sociable afternoon with the Senior Greens, all is forgiven and Adams is actually quite a nice guy. Never mind that he is taking us back into the basement Division in which case we would have made zero progress after 4 years of him leading our club.
 

justanotherfan

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Bristol Rich":1icctow1 said:
And still totally unfounded. The Chairmans of every league club will not divulge how much money they made available to their managers for transfers or wages so let's stop quoting it as fact, it's Adams covering himself.




You are beginning to sound like a member of the flat earth society.
 

Lesley Somerville

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"I would add that he was asked about his alleged tactics of being too defensive. His response was to ask how he can be accused of that when he includes Carey, Ladapo and Lameiras in the same team."

You what??? So a) he doesn't recognise the 'too defensive' tag because b) we have three attacking players on the pitch at the same time??? That is frankly unbelievable, unless I have misunderstood in some way. As I've said before, I really do think the guy is out of his depth. Simon H mentioned 'steep learning curve' in his piece. He wasn't wrong.
 

davie nine

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No. You havenā€™t misunderstood. That is what he said but, as I said, I did not ask the question and neither the questioner or anyone else challenged him.
Pity you werenā€™t there to tell him he is out of his depth, eh?
 

JannerinCardiff

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Bristol Rich":2v9on1pf said:
JannerinCardiff":2v9on1pf said:
Bristol Rich":2v9on1pf said:
And still totally unfounded. The Chairmans of every league club will not divulge how much money they made available to their managers for transfers or wages so let's stop quoting it as fact, it's Adams covering himself.

Didnā€™t someone say the data is circulated at the end of a season - you just hear what you want to hear. We get it you want Adams to go. Some of us just want to hear information.. without spin from you.

When 'information' is supplied you have to question it. You want Adams to stay, we get that as well. So your spin is just as prevalent, it's just arguing a different viewpoint.

Iā€™ve only ever relied on facts not spin. Iā€™ve just stated that Derek Adams has a good record as a manager, and I believe given the chance he will progress us as a club given his past record.You may not like to hear that DA has a good CV, but I deal with facts not arguing something like Adams canā€™t know other clubs budgets when he said all clubs know budgets after the season ends - Iā€™d imagine the EFL need this info. to test financial fair play.

Having an opinion is one thing and I fully respect people have different points of view especially regarding our manager given the circumstances, but to spin things as much as youā€™ve done to validate your view frankly just makes you look silly.
 
Mar 14, 2009
5,148
277
davie nine":1gb8xzwm said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":1gb8xzwm said:
davie nine":1gb8xzwm said:
Ruben Lameiras received his Senior Greens Player of the Season award and thanked us. On behalf the team he assured us that they would all be fully committed to the next 2 games.
ā€˜Key playersā€™ doubtful are Letheren and Ladapo. No point in concealing when it was revealed to 200+ Senior Greens.
DA accepts full responsibility for playing matters this season and for the previous 3 seasons. He encouraged members to ask questions by saying ā€œCome on, give it a goā€ when there was a brief pause in questioning.
Our playing budget was 5th lowest in our league last season per EFL. Current season not known yet.
Admitted that defence has not been compact enough and was particularly disappointed with conceding late goals recently against Bristol Rovers and Blackpool.
Also, concerned that, apart from Ladapo, Lameiras and Carey other midfielders had not contributed with goals. Joel Grantā€™s injury was a major blow as he was having a good season.
He explained attempts to resolve problems with Herald before the ban was decided necessary.
Following this meeting, I am not changing my pro Adams stance. I assume that MGM, rsp4 and oldage were not there to ask questions as I am sure that he would have been prepared to answer their questions frankly.

The way this thread has turned out proves it is right not to go.

You went there and enjoyed it. You liked what he said. Why would l go to change a ā€œpositiveā€ atmosphere for you, and l dare say many others that were there at the meeting.

Iā€™m afraid l have listened to him over and over again. What you have to remember Davie is that for me the game and style Adams talks about isnā€™t the football l witness.

Iā€™m afraid to me all he telling people is excuses. For example, at the end of last season we were one of the lowest goal scoring teams away from home. We knew Ness, Fox and Sarcevic didnā€™t contribute enough goals over a year ago. Today he is telling you there arenā€™t enough goals coming from midfield. Well ....sorry...but ya Duh!!! A year one that midfield, if itā€™s injury free is still our first choice along with Songoā€™o. 12 months on and now he is telling people itā€™s an issue. Surely, this performance/statistical bloke Adams has was pointing this out last season.

Thatā€™s just one issue. There are so many more.

Does any remember Holloway era. Brilliant talker. Green blood...and all that nonsense. ...as a fan base we loved him. It was just words. He left when a better opportunity came along. Holloway and Adams are educated, bright people. When they talk itā€™s bound to sound good. However, as l learnt with Holloway itā€™s just sound bites.

Actions speak louder than words.

So l judge Adams not what he says, but what l see on the pitch. And what l see on the pitch isnā€™t good. At least Holloway could back up his fancy talk by his team performing on the pitch.

Glad you think he is the right bloke but for me if we end up in league 2 l think thatā€™s the only FACT thatā€™s points to Adams, Wotton and Nancekivell being the wrong people to take Argyle forward. It will be four years wasted.
As I have said before, Mickey, I do respect your opinion.
I would add that he was asked about his alleged tactics of being too defensive. His response was to ask how he can be accused of that when he includes Carey, Ladapo and Lameiras in the same team.
Thatā€™s why I wish that you were there to challenge him on this as the questioner didnā€™t.
I guess one argument would be that he didnā€™t use Lameiras regularly until January. He did mention Joel Grant who was playing well in an attacking role and keeping Lameiras out until his unfortunate injury.
Incidentally, I suspect that he may leave Lameiras out of the starting line up on Saturday. I would be disappointed if that happened but if he did that and we won I would be delighted.

I do respect yours and others who think differently from me too.

My Dad apparently was going to go to the meeting. He often has given me stick for my view on Adams. However, last few weeks he has had enough of him. Wants him gone too. I will be intrigued to see if Adams said enough to ā€œwin him back on sideā€.

So just to explain Adams often mentions the budget. However, l feel the budget has no argument when it comes down to plain coaching methods. For example, you say you talk about how Adams canā€™t understand why his tactics are ā€œdefensiveā€ when he has Carey, Lameiras, Ladapo etc ....on the pitch. Well if we look at Barnsley, they were very good. Yet, one of the best things about them was options on the ball. Countless times they had five or six players ahead of the person with the ball. Countless times they had around at least five players in the penalty box. So many options. It was making average crosses, into good ones because there was players in goal scoring positions.

Now letā€™s take Argyle. Next time you watch. Look at how many get ahead of Ladapo/Taylor. It maybe one or possibly two. Have a look at how many frequently get in the box. Look at how many options the player on the ball has. Often itā€™s two, maybe three.

For me you have to get a number of players forward to score. We have the creative players like Carey and Lameiras but who are the options ahead of them. Fox, Ness, Sarcevic or maybe Songoā€™o??? Players who arenā€™t donā€™t get in the box enough or donā€™t look like scoring. No pace in any of them to get up and down the pitch. And yes he addressed this issue today but lm afraid itā€™s been staring him in the face since last season and he decided to go with the same group of midfielders.

However, even with the players we have you could tactically change it. Or maybe coach players he hasnā€™t selected enough to learn to play in those positions and try and run behind the forwards more. For example, ASB. Plays with both feet. Good on the ball and has pace. Neither of these things have been done this year. You may laugh and think thatā€™s an absurd idea but look what happened to Conor Grant when he was put in at left back. Totally transformation because the play was ahead of him and he could use his passing range.

Btw, you are spot on about Joel Grant. He was playing very well. However, thatā€™s why he brought in more players last season. For competition. However, he doesnā€™t seem to have much faith in them as, when fit, he reverts to the same group of 12-13 players with similar tactics every game.
 

dunlop

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The two questions I asked ā€œ it was reported in the papers that you said the players should take responsibility, do you also take responsibility he went all the away around the houses and finally said we all take responsibility ā€œ

I then said it looks like some of the played do not play for the badge, he got quite annoyed with that question saying ā€œ it was not fair on the players, they have got to earn a living they have children to feed.

There was one quote DA made that I really did not understand and in what context it was said perhaps some one else who attended could elaborate more ā€œ if I said what I want to say you would not be to happy ā€œ.
 
Jul 12, 2016
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Pilgrim28":8498pxv8 said:
The thing that really irritates me about Oldage, amongst others, is how he criticises Derek whatever he does. Derek talks openly to a group, you respond by saying ā€œAdamsā€¦ can hold an audience by stating the obviousā€. Derek doesnā€™t talk openly, and you vent anger, for being cagey and not open, towards him unnecessarily. Damned if he does, damned if he doesnā€™t.
I once met Adams in town, he was just walking around. He stopped and chatted to a few fans, and I stopped and had a chat. The chat continued, and he offered to buy me a coffee and continue our chat. 20 mins later, we shook hands and went our separate ways.
My point is, how Derek articulates himself, out of a football environment, is completely different to that, in the football environment. I bet football is horrid and unforgiving, and he is understandably fed up when he is constantly berated. He is human, like myself and probably like Oldage.
I am probably not his biggest fan, but I have every intention of supporting the team and him, until he departs this football club.
Not particularly worried if I irritate you are not.
Adams is a very good public speaker who performs in front of any captive audience who hangs onto his every word. Reflect on what he said yesterday and you will realise you have learned very little new but were entertained. Pity his style of football rarely does. MGM is spot on with his comments.
 
Jan 16, 2010
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Bristol Rich":wb0kv6q5 said:
Nobby":wb0kv6q5 said:
So youā€™re criticising him for ā€œlapping it upā€ because heā€™s pro Adams, but youā€™re Adams Out and have just written it straight off as spin... bit hypocritical.

Yes as it's the same nonsense we have been hearing for ages now.

I'm more interested in the Roy Keane approach, I'm not interested in what he says but what he does and for quite a long time now what he's been doing is shambolic.
roy keane!he was a disaster at ipswich.
 
May 8, 2011
5,788
793
oldage":hnlqm98o said:
Pilgrim28":hnlqm98o said:
The thing that really irritates me about Oldage, amongst others, is how he criticises Derek whatever he does. Derek talks openly to a group, you respond by saying ā€œAdamsā€¦ can hold an audience by stating the obviousā€. Derek doesnā€™t talk openly, and you vent anger, for being cagey and not open, towards him unnecessarily. Damned if he does, damned if he doesnā€™t.
I once met Adams in town, he was just walking around. He stopped and chatted to a few fans, and I stopped and had a chat. The chat continued, and he offered to buy me a coffee and continue our chat. 20 mins later, we shook hands and went our separate ways.
My point is, how Derek articulates himself, out of a football environment, is completely different to that, in the football environment. I bet football is horrid and unforgiving, and he is understandably fed up when he is constantly berated. He is human, like myself and probably like Oldage.
I am probably not his biggest fan, but I have every intention of supporting the team and him, until he departs this football club.
Not particularly worried if I irritate you are not.
Adams is a very good public speaker who performs in front of any captive audience who hangs onto his every word. Reflect on what he said yesterday and you will realise you have learned very little new but were entertained. Pity his style of football rarely does. MGM is spot on with his comments.

We actually were given a lot of information and learnt quite a lot. As I have said to Adams recently, youā€™ve become far more open in public about things at the Club then you were when you first joined.