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Just unacceptable, the Chairman must be concerned.

Sep 16, 2009
449
35
Bournemouth
A lot of strong opinions on this site again this weekend, many from the usual negative posters who funnily enough are usually quiet after we win. The reality this season is we spent no money on players and were never going to compete with the likes of Sunderland and hull city. People harp on about the defeats to struggling sides which is fair enough but those same people gloss over the 2-1 win at Sunderland, the win at Accrington (our bogey team) home wins over Lincoln and Charlton and two draws against portsmouth. Itā€™s not all been bad. 52 points from 41 matches and not relegated. Pre season predictions were that we would finish 19th or 20th so weā€™re currently on track to beat that. Onwards next season
 
Mar 14, 2009
5,148
277
Why canā€™t it be a half way house? Why do we have to always be in one camp or another.

Iā€™m not overly down about this season. Iā€™m not exactly impressed either.

The chairman has been brilliant. Along with the board. This season has been one of the toughest going for everyone concerned. Yet every other club has been in the same boat and ld say thanks to the generosity of our chairman and fans ld say we have been in a better position than a number of clubs this season.

However, everyone talks about pushing on next season. Maybe pushing towards the top end of this league. Yet to do that you have to place building blocks in place for the start of next season. You need a manager with a playing style and a system. I canā€™t say Argyle are currently even a good attacking team. Defensively for two years we have looked a shambles. The 3-5-2 is lop sided where the right hand side doesnā€™t function, yet here we are possibly saying Joe Edwards is our player of the year and Camara is up in that debate. Yet both play on that side of the pitch in a 3-5-2.

Edwards deserves the accolades this season. Yet doesnā€™t this say a lot about us when individually he is our best player but as a team unit we say that right side of the pitch, like yesterday, doesnā€™t function like the left did. The fact he and Camara though individually have performed without that right hand side functioning together consistently surely questions the tactics and the system we play.

Basically next season we need to work out the best system to play. However, we need to fit the players into a system. Yet most of the loanees canā€™t surely stay. From Fornahā€™s lack of midfield presence, to Opoku / Watts constantly making mistakes these players canā€™t be re-signed. So that means a new defence. Maybe even new full backs if we are to play a back four. A new CDM will be required because Macleod canā€™t make it through a season.

Then comes the midfield. Camara and Mayor. Camara is one of my favourite players this season. However, last month or so he hasnā€™t performed as well. Yet his ability to get up and down the pitch, coupled with some ability on the ball makes me think there is a player there. However, heā€™s been asked to do way to much of the work-rate for that midfield. So he needs help next season. If we donā€™t shift Edwards across in midfield then we need new players there.

Then we have up front. Ennis looks quality. Hardie and Jephcott l would have question marks over about their consistency at this level. The thing that Argyle lack is a physical presence up front. So they need to add here.

Yet the biggest issue in our side is creativity. Or lack of it. An End product. Do we keep Mayor? Where can we get the best out of him in our team? Yet even if he stays we need better players on the ball. Better players who can pass and better players who can deliver good crosses.

People just assume we will add a few players and rock up next season and can challenge for the playoffs. Maybe everything will go our way next season. Yet from my point of view there is so much work that needs to be done on the team that you canā€™t expect a number of these issues to be fixed by next season. Yet the biggest issue currently is our manager. One that tells the players the game plan, and then washes his hands at the end of a defeat and says what more can l do?

1. Well you could find a system more suitable for these players
2. Stop the same repetitive defensive mistakes by the same players via coaching
3. Give other players an opportunity

People say itā€™s emotionally reaction after defeats. Yet l feel lā€™ve been asking the same questions most of the season and watching us slip to the same type of results and performances. At what point are we allowed to ask the question why does this continually keep happening?

We talk about building something for next season. You need solid foundations first and currently that team and our manager just look clueless about how to fix the current situation.

I honestly canā€™t say hand on heart we have progressed as a team unit thus season. Sure we have stayed up but when you think of the clubs at the bottom and the 0-4 hammering against Rochdale at HP, the 0-3 defeat against Rovers at their place, the crazy 4-4 at AFC Wimbledon (against a team that struggled to score goals at home all season) and the diabolical defeat at Northampton when they were on a run which couldnā€™t buy them a win. Yet fans expect to take these level of performances this season and suddenly turn them around and jump into a play off race for next season.

Itā€™s just totally unrealistic. Especially when you look at the teams in this league, the fact they have more financial muscle than us and how much better constructed their teams are.

Iā€™m sure our chairman has his finger in the pulse. Iā€™m afraid though itā€™s the fans expectations he will have to deal with. I talk about Argyle in as honest way possible. Frustrated at times yes, but when lā€™ve criticised Argyle itā€™s from the point of view of being honest about what we are witnessing. Yes, itā€™s job done this season. However, itā€™s worrying how we have obtained it and worrying we continue to see the same issues over and over again.

Roll on next season.
 

Tugboat

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Metal_Green_Mickey":22ftv10j said:
Why canā€™t it be a half way house? Why do we have to always be in one camp or another.

Iā€™m not overly down about this season. Iā€™m not exactly impressed either.

The chairman has been brilliant. Along with the board. This season has been one of the toughest going for everyone concerned. Yet every other club has been in the same boat and ld say thanks to the generosity of our chairman and fans ld say we have been in a better position than a number of clubs this season.

However, everyone talks about pushing on next season. Maybe pushing towards the top end of this league. Yet to do that you have to place building blocks in place for the start of next season. You need a manager with a playing style and a system. I canā€™t say Argyle are currently even a good attacking team. Defensively for two years we have looked a shambles. The 3-5-2 is lop sided where the right hand side doesnā€™t function, yet here we are possibly saying Joe Edwards is our player of the year and Camara is up in that debate. Yet both play on that side of the pitch in a 3-5-2.

Edwards deserves the accolades this season. Yet doesnā€™t this say a lot about us when individually he is our best player but as a team unit we say that right side of the pitch, like yesterday, doesnā€™t function like the left did. The fact he and Camara though individually have performed without that right hand side functioning together consistently surely questions the tactics and the system we play.

Basically next season we need to work out the best system to play. However, we need to fit the players into a system. Yet most of the loanees canā€™t surely stay. From Fornahā€™s lack of midfield presence, to Opoku / Watts constantly making mistakes these players canā€™t be re-signed. So that means a new defence. Maybe even new full backs if we are to play a back four. A new CDM will be required because Macleod canā€™t make it through a season.

Then comes the midfield. Camara and Mayor. Camara is one of my favourite players this season. However, last month or so he hasnā€™t performed as well. Yet his ability to get up and down the pitch, coupled with some ability on the ball makes me think there is a player there. However, heā€™s been asked to do way to much of the work-rate for that midfield. So he needs help next season. If we donā€™t shift Edwards across in midfield then we need new players there.

Then we have up front. Ennis looks quality. Hardie and Jephcott l would have question marks over about their consistency at this level. The thing that Argyle lack is a physical presence up front. So they need to add here.

Yet the biggest issue in our side is creativity. Or lack of it. An End product. Do we keep Mayor? Where can we get the best out of him in our team? Yet even if he stays we need better players on the ball. Better players who can pass and better players who can deliver good crosses.

People just assume we will add a few players and rock up next season and can challenge for the playoffs. Maybe everything will go our way next season. Yet from my point of view there is so much work that needs to be done on the team that you canā€™t expect a number of these issues to be fixed by next season. Yet the biggest issue currently is our manager. One that tells the players the game plan, and then washes his hands at the end of a defeat and says what more can l do?

1. Well you could find a system more suitable for these players
2. Stop the same repetitive defensive mistakes by the same players via coaching
3. Give other players an opportunity

People say itā€™s emotionally reaction after defeats. Yet l feel lā€™ve been asking the same questions most of the season and watching us slip to the same type of results and performances. At what point are we allowed to ask the question why does this continually keep happening?

We talk about building something for next season. You need solid foundations first and currently that team and our manager just look clueless about how to fix the current situation.

I honestly canā€™t say hand on heart we have progressed as a team unit thus season. Sure we have stayed up but when you think of the clubs at the bottom and the 0-4 hammering against Rochdale at HP, the 0-3 defeat against Rovers at their place, the crazy 4-4 at AFC Wimbledon (against a team that struggled to score goals at home all season and the diabolical defeat at Northampton when they were on a run which couldnā€™t buy them a win. Yet fans expect to take these level of performances this season and suddenly turn them around and jump into a play off race for next season.

Itā€™s just totally unrealistic. Especially when you look at the teams in this league, the fact they have more financial muscle than us and how much better constructed their teams are.

Iā€™m sure our chairman has his finger in the pulse. Iā€™m afraid though itā€™s the fans expectations he will have to deal with. I talk about Argyle in as honest way possible. Frustrated at times yes, but when lā€™ve criticised Argyle itā€™s from the point of view of being honest about what we are witnessing. Yes, itā€™s job done this season. However, itā€™s worrying how we have obtained it and worrying we continue to see the same issues over and over again.

Roll on next season.

Best post that I have read on here this season.

:clap:
 
Feb 13, 2021
418
285
I just donā€™t know how we are going to get the players we need to be really competitive in this league! We just canā€™t afford them we are the other side of the world as far as most of them are concerned and we have to pay a premium for them to think about coming down here!
Our present players or most of them are not good enough to get us in the top six as we can see at the moment! So how and where are we going to get the players we need!
One thing I do think is that the 12th man will make a difference when they are back! Thereā€™s nobody to lift them or kick them up the butt which can turn the average player into a better player on the day!
Itā€™s a strange season so if there is no improvement next season then we can call for heads to roll!
 

davie nine

R.I.P
Jan 23, 2015
7,785
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Plympton
There is nothing our management can do to change our playing squad in the next month so we are where we are.
In some ways, by selling/ loaning Canavan, Wootton and Nouble in January, RL has started the process for next season. The loan players will go back to their clubs and decisions/offers will be made about players who are out of contract.
Simon Hallett has said that we have to be ā€˜smartā€™ with regard to recruitment and I am sure that that process has already started.
I would hope that lessons have been learned in this consolidating season and that we will start next season with a solid, balanced spine of experienced and skilful players who can be added to those we have already got contracted for next season.
It would be good to be close to 60 points by the end of this season.
 

Forest of Dean Green

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Mar 5, 2009
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Tugboat":k3iuhc9s said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":k3iuhc9s said:
Why canā€™t it be a half way house? Why do we have to always be in one camp or another.

Iā€™m not overly down about this season. Iā€™m not exactly impressed either.

The chairman has been brilliant. Along with the board. This season has been one of the toughest going for everyone concerned. Yet every other club has been in the same boat and ld say thanks to the generosity of our chairman and fans ld say we have been in a better position than a number of clubs this season.

However, everyone talks about pushing on next season. Maybe pushing towards the top end of this league. Yet to do that you have to place building blocks in place for the start of next season. You need a manager with a playing style and a system. I canā€™t say Argyle are currently even a good attacking team. Defensively for two years we have looked a shambles. The 3-5-2 is lop sided where the right hand side doesnā€™t function, yet here we are possibly saying Joe Edwards is our player of the year and Camara is up in that debate. Yet both play on that side of the pitch in a 3-5-2.

Edwards deserves the accolades this season. Yet doesnā€™t this say a lot about us when individually he is our best player but as a team unit we say that right side of the pitch, like yesterday, doesnā€™t function like the left did. The fact he and Camara though individually have performed without that right hand side functioning together consistently surely questions the tactics and the system we play.

Basically next season we need to work out the best system to play. However, we need to fit the players into a system. Yet most of the loanees canā€™t surely stay. From Fornahā€™s lack of midfield presence, to Opoku / Watts constantly making mistakes these players canā€™t be re-signed. So that means a new defence. Maybe even new full backs if we are to play a back four. A new CDM will be required because Macleod canā€™t make it through a season.

Then comes the midfield. Camara and Mayor. Camara is one of my favourite players this season. However, last month or so he hasnā€™t performed as well. Yet his ability to get up and down the pitch, coupled with some ability on the ball makes me think there is a player there. However, heā€™s been asked to do way to much of the work-rate for that midfield. So he needs help next season. If we donā€™t shift Edwards across in midfield then we need new players there.

Then we have up front. Ennis looks quality. Hardie and Jephcott l would have question marks over about their consistency at this level. The thing that Argyle lack is a physical presence up front. So they need to add here.

Yet the biggest issue in our side is creativity. Or lack of it. An End product. Do we keep Mayor? Where can we get the best out of him in our team? Yet even if he stays we need better players on the ball. Better players who can pass and better players who can deliver good crosses.

People just assume we will add a few players and rock up next season and can challenge for the playoffs. Maybe everything will go our way next season. Yet from my point of view there is so much work that needs to be done on the team that you canā€™t expect a number of these issues to be fixed by next season. Yet the biggest issue currently is our manager. One that tells the players the game plan, and then washes his hands at the end of a defeat and says what more can l do?

1. Well you could find a system more suitable for these players
2. Stop the same repetitive defensive mistakes by the same players via coaching
3. Give other players an opportunity

People say itā€™s emotionally reaction after defeats. Yet l feel lā€™ve been asking the same questions most of the season and watching us slip to the same type of results and performances. At what point are we allowed to ask the question why does this continually keep happening?

We talk about building something for next season. You need solid foundations first and currently that team and our manager just look clueless about how to fix the current situation.

I honestly canā€™t say hand on heart we have progressed as a team unit thus season. Sure we have stayed up but when you think of the clubs at the bottom and the 0-4 hammering against Rochdale at HP, the 0-3 defeat against Rovers at their place, the crazy 4-4 at AFC Wimbledon (against a team that struggled to score goals at home all season and the diabolical defeat at Northampton when they were on a run which couldnā€™t buy them a win. Yet fans expect to take these level of performances this season and suddenly turn them around and jump into a play off race for next season.

Itā€™s just totally unrealistic. Especially when you look at the teams in this league, the fact they have more financial muscle than us and how much better constructed their teams are.

Iā€™m sure our chairman has his finger in the pulse. Iā€™m afraid though itā€™s the fans expectations he will have to deal with. I talk about Argyle in as honest way possible. Frustrated at times yes, but when lā€™ve criticised Argyle itā€™s from the point of view of being honest about what we are witnessing. Yes, itā€™s job done this season. However, itā€™s worrying how we have obtained it and worrying we continue to see the same issues over and over again.

Roll on next season.

Best post that I have read on here this season.

:clap:

I think the right side/left side debate is interesting. One of the reasons why the right side attack seems less effective is because of Mayor. Heā€™s the principal link between defence and attack, and will drop back to collect the ball before taking us up the pitch. And heā€™s both positioned and naturally gravitates to the left of the pitch. Heā€™s often the out ball for Fornah as well. Camara ranges around more and is often closer to the middle of the pitch. Mayor likes to occupy that space so that he can do what he likes to do, cut in on his right foot and either look for a shot (usually blocked) or a ball into the box or he likes to take the ball to the byline and cut back in. Camara doesnā€™t play the same way, and doesnā€™t spend so much time on the ball as Mayor. Nor does ge feed Edwards like Mayor does to Lewis or Grant. So we attack more down that left side because of Mayorā€™s position and the time he spends on the ball. Is it more effective though? Edwards has scored 8 after all. Although some of those benefit from balls from the left.
 

oddball

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Argyle were looking to establish themselves in a mid table position if not higher this season with the aim of pushing on in future seasons...the performance this season must come as a bitter disappointment not only for the chairman but also the board of directors...
 
Feb 8, 2005
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oddball":154kgsfa said:
Argyle were looking to establish themselves in a mid table position if not higher this season with the aim of pushing on in future seasons...the performance this season must come as a bitter disappointment not only for the chairman but also the board of directors...

How can you say that we were looking for a mid table position, if not higher?

Where did you get this from?

Lowe said as high as we can get.

We will be in mid table position (neither in the play-offs nor in the relegation places) by the end of the season.

Job done.

Any bitter disappointment comes from the supporters who always have a higher expectation than the rest of us, or even the management or the board.

I am sure Mr Hallett will be pleased with the way the season has gone. As always ups and downs on the field of play, but Covid has had a huge effect, not only financially but practically as well.

We supporters look forward to another season in this division, which may not be said for one or two of the other clubs promoted with us.

Try not to be over expectant next season, Oddball, and you will not be disappointed I am sure.
 
Aug 5, 2015
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760
We might well finish nearer the foot of the table than we are now but we have so many more points than the bottom four itā€™s untrue.
We just got promoted. We survived. Thatā€™s a success in my view. If we get to invest in some better players next season then who knows. Iā€™ve seen too many really crap seasons since 1968 so I know the difference between a good season and a bad season. This has not been a bad season. Weā€™re still standing. We move on hopefully.
 
Oct 5, 2013
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Kentishgreen":2h51d4hr said:
We might well finish nearer the foot of the table than we are now but we have so many more points than the bottom four itā€™s untrue.
We just got promoted. We survived. Thatā€™s a success in my view. If we get to invest in some better players next season then who knows. Iā€™ve seen too many really crap seasons since 1968 so I know the difference between a good season and a bad season. This has not been a bad season. Weā€™re still standing. We move on hopefully.

Well said.
 

Biggs

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Agreed.

And people forget how quickly things change in football, especially at this level you can go from down-and-out to world beaters with one signing (looking at you, Toumani Diagouraga). Let alone a whole summer in a strong and stable position to recharge, plan, rebuild... sign a whole new defence :lol:

None of us have any idea whatsoever what will happen next season, but we could just as easily be promoted as be relegated. Neither would surprise me in the least.
 

Mark58

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Kentishgreen":2eqsttb4 said:
We might well finish nearer the foot of the table than we are now but we have so many more points than the bottom four itā€™s untrue.
We just got promoted. We survived. Thatā€™s a success in my view. If we get to invest in some better players next season then who knows. Iā€™ve seen too many really crap seasons since 1968 so I know the difference between a good season and a bad season. This has not been a bad season. Weā€™re still standing. We move on hopefully.

Same here, KG - although I have one more year of 'suffering', having started my journey in 1967 :lol: The lot of an Argyle fan has never been easy but if anyone wants 'easy' they can choose to support, say, Man City (at least until they go off the boil and are overtaken by someone else - then switch!)

I doubt whether a single one of us is in 'this' for anything other than the long haul. Whilst we go through short term highs (occasionally) and short term lows (regularly) I feel that the most important thing is not to lose sight of the ultimate target. I believe that we are on the right track, with a good owner, a vastly improved infrastructure and a solid HR pyramid.

Yes, I have been frustrated by all sorts of things this season but if we are still in League 1 for next season I will compare it to the start of 2019/20 and take that as a mark of success. :scarf:
 

jerryatricjanner

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Too many expecting too much too soon I feel. It has been an abnormal year or so and clubs need to make sure they survive the covid 18 months and come out the other side safely before looking to push on. I think compared to most clubs we will come out of it quite well.
 
Mar 14, 2009
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277
Itā€™s not really about expecting anything more. When we did the season predictions l said around about this position.

You may change the players but you still have to have things in place to build on.

Best example l can provide is 16/17 season under Adams. Remember that team finished just outside the playoffs. Everyone was so excited for the following season. My issue was the way we defended as a team and our play style.

We still had Carey & Lameiras. We added goals from Lapado. Yet we lost one key player in the heart of that defence. Sonny Bradley. We literally fell apart.

The issue isnā€™t our position. Itā€™s not even the results. Itā€™s our performances this season.

Everyone is right. New players will come in. We might see a totally different Argyle. However, based on how we play currently l donā€™t see an identity under Lowe. I donā€™t see a playing style or a philosophy. I just see a team struggling at both ends of the field.

Iā€™m not sure itā€™s wrong to expect a team to not give away ā€˜park leagueā€™ standard goals most weeks. Iā€™m not sure itā€™s too much to expect a team to pass consistently to a green shirt. And l donā€™t think itā€™s asking too much for a team to sometimes, not all the time, turn up in the second half of games or have a bit more of a backbone when the opposition score.

I guess maybe my expectations are too high, although l thought they are reasonable points.