Summer Recruitment

Andy B. · Apr 12, 2021

This season was about staying up. Consolidating. We achieved this.

Where the downside is lurks in the last 15 or so games we are ending the season on a downward trajectory. Various reasons here to address are the lack of plan B in playing style, the poor decision making on the pitch at times, and tactical flexibility formation wise.

The players need to take ownership of performances when things are going wrong We lack leaders on the field at times - I'm not talking about the captain I'm referring to people prepared to let others know what's going awry. We can be too nice.

That all being said its largely job done. Its been a weird season for obvious reasons and we are in place to have a real go next year at a top 7 finish.

Recruitment is the key and Deswnip and Lowe will know what they want and who is needed and who's superfluous.

We can be happy at this seasons outcome. We honestly can. Next season will give us a proper picture of where we are as a team and as a club.

Oh and the new stand will come online fully - it will start adding to our non match day income and on match days its will be great to have noise from all sides of Home Park again.

Many reasons to be hopeful all in all.

Forest of Dean Green · Apr 12, 2021

Metal_Green_Mickey":1v925hte said:
People keep saying stuff like the fans aren’t experts.

So OK. I get that. We aren’t.

However, we have all watched a lot of football throughout the different decades. Fans can’t agree on players they like and dislike because we all enjoy different styles and attributes in football.

However, the fans aren’t stupid. There are a number of great posters on here, with whom l have differing views, but often eloquently make some very valid points.

Data analysis is all well and good. It might tell you that player made 87 out of 100 complete short passes. However, were most of those passes sideways/backwards or were they passed forward in order to get the team moving up the park. There might be a player with only 70 out of 100 compete short passes but his passes actually lead to the team moving up the field.

I just think the answer isn’t just using data analysis but watching a player in the flesh numerous times which l hope Argyle continues to do as well.

I think the data is now so sophisticated it would tell you all those things as well to be honest.

Metal Green Mickey · Apr 13, 2021

Forest of Dean Green":1mqyh2ht said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":1mqyh2ht said:

People keep saying stuff like the fans aren’t experts.

So OK. I get that. We aren’t.

However, we have all watched a lot of football throughout the different decades. Fans can’t agree on players they like and dislike because we all enjoy different styles and attributes in football.

However, the fans aren’t stupid. There are a number of great posters on here, with whom l have differing views, but often eloquently make some very valid points.

Data analysis is all well and good. It might tell you that player made 87 out of 100 complete short passes. However, were most of those passes sideways/backwards or were they passed forward in order to get the team moving up the park. There might be a player with only 70 out of 100 compete short passes but his passes actually lead to the team moving up the field.

I just think the answer isn’t just using data analysis but watching a player in the flesh numerous times which l hope Argyle continues to do as well.

Click to expand...

I think the data is now so sophisticated it would tell you all those things as well to be honest.

To be honest your probably right.

My point really is you can have all the data in the world at your disposal but it needs to be entwined with common sense.

When we started this season we as fans knew we were playing with a back 3. That still don’t stop our manager bringing in a slow CB and playing him on the left of the three. He has been exposed all season by pace. He then brings in Opoku. A left footed defender with pace. Yet instead of shifting your slowest CB to the middle and moving Opoku to Watts position he left things unchanged. We continued to give away goal after goal by similar means to different opposition.

I thought Argyle currently had a data analysis guy who looked at games. So either data analysis isn’t highlighting Watts lack of pace is an issue or our manager just simply ignores the problem.

Whichever it is, l just think this type of situation shows data analysis can only take you so far.

Quintrell Green · Apr 13, 2021

I can take all this on board but RL is limited as to what he can do to improve matters when he has limited playing alternatives for the weaker positions and he had only the Christmas transfer window to operate in, during a period of very limited cash flow. Sadly, gone are the old days when transfers took place throughout the season, but perhaps I am looking back too far. It just goes to show that Argyle's recruitment needs to be 'spot on' but I expect every club are saying the same.

davie nine · Apr 13, 2021

davie nine":7mxew7zu said:
jimsing":7mxew7zu said:

There is more to football than just kicking the ball, and data cannot solely be used as a first choice decision making implement, although it can be pretty useful in some areas.

Ball control is a must, especially the further up the league you get. That has to be first on the list of data. Being comfortable on the ball has to be another.

Protecting the ball from the opposing player is something that should be taught at a very young age, so that when they get to the first team it becomes natural, rather than forced.
So many times I see our players getting the ball and turning the wrong way, or get muscled off the ball, or other players do not make themselves available to help out.

Being able to head the ball has to be another skill, regardless of position, that the academy players should have to have. The number of times that someone like Mayor tracks back with a player, for a corner maybe, and makes no effort to head the ball. He's not a great header of the ball, he just tries to be a presence to put the opposing player off.

Shoulder to shoulder contact is part of the game but it seems that if a player goes down he gets a free kick, regardless. More input should be placed on this throughout the academy so that the players can deal with it when they get to the first team.

There is a difference between youth football and first team football and players must be skilled as soon as they get into the first team squad, not have to pick these things up when they get into the first team. I'm afraid Lolos may not have done enough and gets pushed off the ball too easily and we may lose him at the end of the season.

We have to wait for the fruits of the academy to bring forward first team players automatically. They need to be coached into how to play men's football so that they are ready when called upon and we may have to wait a few seasons for the current academy to provide our team with ready made players. Jephers and Coops are the exception, and there may be one or two who may be able to follow, but that will be because of their own footballing traits and not due to the change in coaching which has only just started to take effect.

These are not dark arts. These are the ways that the game should be played.

The squad should be made aware of how the opposition use the dark arts, and be shown how to nullify them, or at least deal with them.

Referees are so different in how they manage the game. More importantly some referees are more easily conned than others and the Club should make the players aware of how each referee will react to the various situations that occur.

Small advantages turn into big advantages if the players are given the right information about how the referees deal with the nuances of the game.

It's no good managers complaining about a certain refereeing decision after the match if the referee has a reputation for it before the match begins!

Men v boys has been the name of the game in several matches this season, but that will always be the case when we rely on youngsters, either through our academy, or on loan.

Experience is gained through time and every successful team has to have a mixture of both youth and experience. We are lacking in the latter, especially in our defence, but we must give Lowe the opportunity to put this right in the summer as he allowed, rightly in my mind, our experience to leave in January.

Be optimistic for next season. An improvement would be a top half finish with a flirt at the play-offs a possibility must be the target. Improvement season on season has to be the target.

Recruitment will always be the key, so let us hope that Lowe and his staff can improve the team each season until we become more experienced, more battle conscious, more street-wise, and then we can have a go at promotion, just like we did last season, before Covid came our way.

More experienced players don't come cheap but we have the grandstand to get us extra profit, and lets hope Covid doesn't curtail its effectiveness in providing extra cash for the first team, although there will be other expenses that the grandstand will have to provide for, and catering for Covid may be an added expense in itself.

Summer is always interesting and frustrating at the same time. When do the new arrivals arrive? Who will they be? What positions will they vie for? Who will stay with us? Who will leave for elsewhere? Always exciting to see the fixture list for the first time, but the summer recruitment will be the most interesting part of this summer, for sure.

Click to expand...

Excellent post, jimsing.
You list most, if not all, of the attributes that a team needs to be successful in the EFL and we should be comparing our team’s attributes with other teams in League 1 this season.
I would suggest that we have a way to go to compete with the better teams in this league on a number of attributes that you have raised. These include instant ball control, comfort on and protecting the ball and ability to use body strength to retain possession and not be muscled off the ball.
I would also agree that we need to have more experience and be more battle conscious and street wise, particularly in the spine of the team. We should not only be able to head the ball, but direct it accurately. With regard to accuracy and power, we do not have many current players who can shoot powerfully and accurately from dead ball situations.
I agree with Philevs and Mark58; this board is for opinions and your post has provided us with the opportunity to make comparisons with our opponents based on what we have seen with our own eyes, home and away, this season.
Of course, we are not experts and we would all hope that, based on what we have seen, our management team will be striving to make improvements in these areas for next season.

Going back to jimsing’s post:-
1. Who are our best players at controlling and protecting the ball?
2. Who is able to use his body strength to retain possession and not be muscled off the ball?
3. Who are our most experienced players in the spine of our team?
4. Who are our best co-ordinated and accurate headers of a ball?
5. Who are our best players who can shoot with power and accuracy?
I am sure that there are other questions that could be added related to speed, skill, determination and stamina.
Maybe, it would also be worth considering who, in the leading teams in our league, have these qualities that, perhaps, we are lacking?

Biggs · Apr 13, 2021

All professional footballers can do those things in their relative positions, at this level it comes down to unbelievably fine margins in an already low-scoring sport. So it's to what incredibly high level and consistency can you perform those tasks.

The difference between a League 1 player and a League 2 player will be as little as requiring 4 chances to score instead of 5. Or being able to complete a tricky under-pressure pass 90 times out of 100 instead of 85. Or misplacing a simple ball only 3 times in 100 instead of 5 times. Etc etc etc.

And obviously doing all those things is harder with the 5-10% increase in quality of opposition. And while we might despair at simple mistakes made, you don't accumulate 50-60 points at third tier level by being bad at football.

Graham Clark · Apr 14, 2021

For anyone interested on how and why data analytics has become important in football this is the most informative article I have read. Analytics do not replace the instinctive 'eye for a player' but narrows the margins of error in assessing that player.

https://soccerment.com/the-importance-o ... analytics/

On the 'tried and tested' approach to recruitment I was surprised at our pre-season / pre expiry transfer window recruitment experience levels - Reeves (167 League 1 appearances), Macleod (53 Championship) Nouble (80 Championship, 65 League 1), Camara (103 League 2), Opoku (21 League 1) Watts (15 League 2). It is not experience that is required but the right experience and ability.

As I have stated before there were unique circumstances behind the extent and quality of this season's recruitment. That will not be repeated this time round as finances are better than expected and League 1 standard players have been seen in match conditions for a more detailed assessment. Hopefully, the data analytics will help as much as hoped to gain that much sought after competitive advantage.

Finally, i remember Paul Sturrock saying that only about 50% of his signings worked out. I still shudder at some of the players he signed. However, the 50% that did work out served us remarkably well and we have to hope that Ryan Lowe's summer recruitment can go some way to mirroring that positive achievement.

HC Green · Apr 14, 2021

Nice to know that finances are better than expected, even before season tickets sales or what the stadium capacity for next season are known. Where is that information about finances available to see as I don’t remember reading it anywhere?

Graham Clark · Apr 14, 2021

]

Quote from the Club’s financial report February 2020

‘Simon has supported the club generously throughout the past few years, and this generosity has provided the club with a good financial platform upon which to build. This is certainly the strongest opportunity the club has had in many years to create sustainable success.

The club has weathered the storm of the pandemic very well. Simon’s recent cash injection, along with the support of the Green Army, gives us resources for the future and the breathing room to recover fully from the absence of fans at Home Park during the 2020/21 season.’

IJN · Apr 15, 2021

Going back to data driven analysis etc, can anyone explain Frank Nouble's signing to me? :wtf:

Neil Dewsnip seems a highly confident fellow, so I look forward to our new recruits next season, I really do. The management team at PAFC seems to be top notch so let's hope they can produce miracles on our budget and taking into account our geographical position.

Anyone that thinks Plymouth isn't out on a limb, needs to believe people, when they say it REALLY is. I've spoken to many many people over the years, ranging from Kevin Nugent to Jimmy Floyd Hasslebank who stress for Argyle to get great players is really a complement to the managers that achieve it.

Graham Clark · Apr 15, 2021

I think Frank Nouble was a ‘heart over head’ signing’. Ryan Lowe was the Sky pundit for Colchester’s Play Off semi final and Nouble had a spectacular game which Lowe raved over at the time. Perhaps he thought he would give us alternatives up top given his extensive experience. To his credit he realised the error and moved him on in the next window back to Colchester.

(In my previous post which I cannot edit it should have course be February 2021 not 2020),

oldage · Apr 15, 2021

Graham Clark":3fni431g said:
For anyone interested on how and why data analytics has become important in football this is the most informative article I have read. Analytics do not replace the instinctive 'eye for a player' but narrows the margins of error in assessing that player.

https://soccerment.com/the-importance-o ... analytics/

On the 'tried and tested' approach to recruitment I was surprised at our pre-season / pre expiry transfer window recruitment experience levels - Reeves (167 League 1 appearances), Macleod (53 Championship) Nouble (80 Championship, 65 League 1), Camara (103 League 2), Opoku (21 League 1) Watts (15 League 2). It is not experience that is required but the right experience and ability.

As I have stated before there were unique circumstances behind the extent and quality of this season's recruitment. That will not be repeated this time round as finances are better than expected and League 1 standard players have been seen in match conditions for a more detailed assessment. Hopefully, the data analytics will help as much as hoped to gain that much sought after competitive advantage.

Finally, i remember Paul Sturrock saying that only about 50% of his signings worked out. I still shudder at some of the players he signed. However, the 50% that did work out served us remarkably well and we have to hope that Ryan Lowe's summer recruitment can go some way to mirroring that positive achievement.

Does the data show a player's temperament,resilience and footballing brain. IMO we rely too much on the stats.
I can imagine Lowe and his backroom staff scratching their heads because "computer says" but often it's not working.

jerryatricjanner · Apr 15, 2021

Graham Clark":3uiibjqr said:
I think Frank Nouble was a ‘heart over head’ signing’. Ryan Lowe was the Sky pundit for Colchester’s Play Off semi final and Nouble had a spectacular game which Lowe raved over at the time. Perhaps he thought he would give us alternatives up top given his extensive experience. To his credit he realised the error and moved him on in the next window back to Colchester.

(In my previous post which I cannot edit it should have course be February 2021 not 2020),

Also Graham, Nouble caused us untold problems in our 3 nil defeat at Colchester last season.

mutley marvel · Apr 15, 2021

From the comments of other posters- i get the impression they see the players they recruit as possibly robots who should be able to hit their peak consistently from the data gathered over x amount of time & games played

What the players bodies & mind do over the 90 plus minutes is 2 separate components of the game

Yes they may cover x amount of ground as RL keeps harping on about in his post match comments but if they have not got much upstairs in the football brain department as the previous poster as mentioned what does the computer say- sorry we dont have a section that includes switching off at vital times or poor decision making

Maybe they could invest in a sports physiologist who would be able to give them the tools needed to be proactive when falling behind instead of the passive, shell shocked unit we have seen on a regular basis

One question for very knowledgeable people in this field- does Data analytics have a factory reset or a section saying the data provided is inaccurate :think:

Graham Clark · Apr 15, 2021

In the article I highlighted above perhaps this section is the most relevant to the debate,

Smart scouting: three reasons
In our view, data analytics is a very powerful scouting tool, for three main reasons:

Savings. Searching for players in large and detailed databases allows clubs to save incredible amounts of time and money. After applying the desired filters, the scout can restrict the area of interest to a selected number of players and start seeing videos of this group. In our hypothetical scouting funnel, conceptualised in the picture below, thanks to the videos the scout can further filter the number of players to go and watch live. We believe that databases cannot replace scouts, but rather that they can complement their talent identification skills.

Silicon has more memory than you or I. Do you remember all the actions, all the shots, all the crosses and dribbles by your favourite team in the past season? Of courses not. And the same would be true even if we restrict the analysis to your favourite player. On the contrary, while a computer doesn’t have a favourite team or player, it can remember everything that has occurred in past seasons. This is invaluable for scouts, who are often misled by the over- or under-performance of a player in a specific game, or even over a more extended period.

Limiting pre-conceptions. Skimming through databases often gives rise to counter-intuitive results. In some cases, these might be false positives. In other cases, they deliver proper “eureka moments”: your eyes didn’t capture that particular skill from that particular player, but the next time you watch him, everything becomes clear.

Recruitment is not a precise science. The data helps and the better it is the more it helps. It's sieve but no substitute for seeing and meeting the player and asking trusted others for second and third opinions. It's a balance between identifying improvers, using experience and bringing academy players into the team. There are some obvious deficiencies and disappointments in the last two transfer windows recruitment but it was good enough to ensure the aim of survival which is on the verge of delivery. There have been some good signings too.

In addition, the likes of Craske, Crocker, Mitchell, Pursall and Tomlinson have been blooded in the 1st XI. We also have Law, Lolos and Randell as well as Cooper and Jephcott. We probably haven't played so many youngsters in a season before. Hopefully, some will establish themselves in the first team squad next season.

Perhaps I just have more faith in Ryan Lowe and his management team than some others but I am optimistic for next season having learnt some lessons of the realities of League 1 football.

Summer Recruitment

Andy B.

Forest of Dean Green

Metal Green Mickey

Quintrell Green

davie nine

Biggs

Administrator

Graham Clark

HC Green

Graham Clark

IJN

Site Owner

Graham Clark

oldage

jerryatricjanner

mutley marvel

Graham Clark