#incoming (Macaulay Gillesphey signs) | Page 6 | PASOTI
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#incoming (Macaulay Gillesphey signs)

Mar 21, 2010
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Plymouth
gaspargomez":stuj41ic said:
I thought the plan was to sign proven League One defenders ?


The fact is Argyle has only signed one- Wilson from Ipswich.

Scarr and Gillesphey are unproven and untried at League One level. We have been in this situation previously and it hasn’t worked out well.

Proven league one defenders like Canavan and Wootton ?
 
Mar 14, 2009
5,148
277
DartingtonPilgrim":38o8kxh0 said:
gaspargomez":38o8kxh0 said:
I thought the plan was to sign proven League One defenders ?


The fact is Argyle has only signed one- Wilson from Ipswich.

Scarr and Gillesphey are unproven and untried at League One level. We have been in this situation previously and it hasn’t worked out well.

Proven league one defenders like Canavan and Wootton ?

If you listened to MK Dons and Rochdale fans l remember especially Wootton they warned us they weren’t league one standard.

Nathan Baker from Bristol City would be a decent league one defender. Injury prone but good pedigree. Unfortunately, these type of players cost money.
 
Mar 21, 2010
1,739
675
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Plymouth
Metal_Green_Mickey":372q9uig said:
DartingtonPilgrim":372q9uig said:
gaspargomez":372q9uig said:
I thought the plan was to sign proven League One defenders ?


The fact is Argyle has only signed one- Wilson from Ipswich.

Scarr and Gillesphey are unproven and untried at League One level. We have been in this situation previously and it hasn’t worked out well.

Proven league one defenders like Canavan and Wootton ?

If you listened to MK Dons and Rochdale fans l remember especially Wootton they warned us they weren’t league one standard.

Nathan Baker from Bristol City would be a decent league one defender. Injury prone but good pedigree. Unfortunately, these type of players cost money.

Merely asking the question if this was what gaspargomez meant by proven league one defenders , as both had extensive league one experience .
My own opinion is that I am happy to wait and see how the new lads settle and perform for Argyle. I also feel that we are shopping within our means , which most certainly means we are unlikely to sign players like Nathan Baker.
 
Mar 14, 2009
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DartingtonPilgrim":3jwuzdeh said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":3jwuzdeh said:
DartingtonPilgrim":3jwuzdeh said:
gaspargomez":3jwuzdeh said:
I thought the plan was to sign proven League One defenders ?


The fact is Argyle has only signed one- Wilson from Ipswich.

Scarr and Gillesphey are unproven and untried at League One level. We have been in this situation previously and it hasn’t worked out well.

Proven league one defenders like Canavan and Wootton ?

If you listened to MK Dons and Rochdale fans l remember especially Wootton they warned us they weren’t league one standard.

Nathan Baker from Bristol City would be a decent league one defender. Injury prone but good pedigree. Unfortunately, these type of players cost money.

Merely asking the question if this was what gaspargomez meant by proven league one defenders , as both had extensive league one experience .
My own opinion is that I am happy to wait and see how the new lads settle and perform for Argyle. I also feel that we are shopping within our means , which most certainly means we are unlikely to sign players like Nathan Baker.

No agree with waiting to see how these players perform for us. I don’t understand how you can judge beforehand. Some players work better with other managers and systems. With Wootton and Canavan l was just pointing out what rivals fans thought when they seen them at that level. To be fair to Canavan l think his injury record was an issue.

Agree about Baker too. I just think that’s what some fans are hoping for but like you said they cost serious money.
 
Aug 5, 2016
5,100
1,408
Metal_Green_Mickey":2a12724j said:
DartingtonPilgrim":2a12724j said:
gaspargomez":2a12724j said:
I thought the plan was to sign proven League One defenders ?


The fact is Argyle has only signed one- Wilson from Ipswich.

Scarr and Gillesphey are unproven and untried at League One level. We have been in this situation previously and it hasn’t worked out well.

Proven league one defenders like Canavan and Wootton ?

If you listened to MK Dons and Rochdale fans l remember especially Wootton they warned us they weren’t league one standard.

Nathan Baker from Bristol City would be a decent league one defender. Injury prone but good pedigree. Unfortunately, these type of players cost money.

Players from the division above usually do cost a lot of money. Money we don’t have btw.

Canavan and Wootton were part of a good defence that got out of League Two. It is fashionable to slag them off.

The other defenders we had to compare them to beforehand were Bradley and Vyner, and sadly for the next lads in the door both of those were Championship level defenders. We were lucky to have two at the same time and they made everyone else look poor by comparison.

If Canavan was as crap as some make out, then why did we miss him so much when he went to Bradford?

Have a look at our form after January after Wootton and Canavan went, and it doesn’t support the judgement that they were the problem.
 

davie nine

R.I.P
Jan 23, 2015
7,785
347
77
Plympton
Our defence was performing reasonably well in January and early February without Canavan.
Then, a couple of poor results and it was his experience that we missed.
At least, these new defenders have some experience in the EFL so, hopefully, the wheels won’t come off in such a spectacular fashion.
 
Mar 14, 2009
5,148
277
Knibbsworth":secn1o3v said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":secn1o3v said:
DartingtonPilgrim":secn1o3v said:
gaspargomez":secn1o3v said:
I thought the plan was to sign proven League One defenders ?


The fact is Argyle has only signed one- Wilson from Ipswich.

Scarr and Gillesphey are unproven and untried at League One level. We have been in this situation previously and it hasn’t worked out well.

Proven league one defenders like Canavan and Wootton ?

If you listened to MK Dons and Rochdale fans l remember especially Wootton they warned us they weren’t league one standard.

Nathan Baker from Bristol City would be a decent league one defender. Injury prone but good pedigree. Unfortunately, these type of players cost money.

Players from the division above usually do cost a lot of money. Money we don’t have btw.

Canavan and Wootton were part of a good defence that got out of League Two. It is fashionable to slag them off.

The other defenders we had to compare them to beforehand were Bradley and Vyner, and sadly for the next lads in the door both of those were Championship level defenders. We were lucky to have two at the same time and they made everyone else look poor by comparison.

If Canavan was as crap as some make out, then why did we miss him so much when he went to Bradford?

Have a look at our form after January after Wootton and Canavan went, and it doesn’t support the judgement that they were the problem.

The same Canavan that played in 38 games in league one under Adams and helped to get us relegated. If he wasn’t part of the problem then lm not sure what was.

As for Wootton we all saw enough of him. He tried. He gave everything. Yet he wasn’t as good as Canavan. The same Canavan, who with Edwards, allowed us to have shipped in 80 league one goals.

The only reason why Canavan and Wootton would be looked back with any fondness was because how bad Apoku and Watts were in the final few months.

They both starred in the 0-4 home defeat against Rochdale. One of the worst displays at HP last season.

Put it this way. You saw how bad our defence was last season. And Lowe choose to ship them out. So if they aren’t the problem, then Lowe’s judgement must be very questionable because he played Watts almost every game last season.
 
Aug 5, 2016
5,100
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Metal_Green_Mickey":17759wl1 said:
Knibbsworth":17759wl1 said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":17759wl1 said:
DartingtonPilgrim":17759wl1 said:
gaspargomez":17759wl1 said:
I thought the plan was to sign proven League One defenders ?


The fact is Argyle has only signed one- Wilson from Ipswich.

Scarr and Gillesphey are unproven and untried at League One level. We have been in this situation previously and it hasn’t worked out well.

Proven league one defenders like Canavan and Wootton ?

If you listened to MK Dons and Rochdale fans l remember especially Wootton they warned us they weren’t league one standard.

Nathan Baker from Bristol City would be a decent league one defender. Injury prone but good pedigree. Unfortunately, these type of players cost money.

Players from the division above usually do cost a lot of money. Money we don’t have btw.

Canavan and Wootton were part of a good defence that got out of League Two. It is fashionable to slag them off.

The other defenders we had to compare them to beforehand were Bradley and Vyner, and sadly for the next lads in the door both of those were Championship level defenders. We were lucky to have two at the same time and they made everyone else look poor by comparison.

If Canavan was as crap as some make out, then why did we miss him so much when he went to Bradford?

Have a look at our form after January after Wootton and Canavan went, and it doesn’t support the judgement that they were the problem.

The same Canavan that played in 38 games in league one under Adams and helped to get us relegated. If he wasn’t part of the problem then lm not sure what was.

As for Wootton we all saw enough of him. He tried. He gave everything. Yet he wasn’t as good as Canavan. The same Canavan, who with Edwards, allowed us to have shipped in 80 league one goals.

The only reason why Canavan and Wootton would be looked back with any fondness was because how bad Apoku and Watts were in the final few months.

They both starred in the 0-4 home defeat against Rochdale. One of the worst displays at HP last season.

Put it this way. You saw how bad our defence was last season. And Lowe choose to ship them out. So if they aren’t the problem, then Lowe’s judgement must be very questionable because he played Watts almost every game last season.

“Helped us get relegated”. What an odd phrase.

Teams can only compete at any level when they are all pulling in the same direction, and for reasons unknown that wasn’t the case. Players downed tools for Adams and not many on here know the specifics, myself included.

However to blame exclusively Canavan and Wootton for the relegation season is a little bizarre. (Especially when Wootton wasn’t even really playing.)

Do you use the same argument to decide Lameiras, Ladapo and Carey couldn’t really cut it at League One level? Of course you wouldn’t.

When you consider DA’s team shouldn’t have got relegated on 50 points (but for that awful dressing room capitulation), that under Lowe they won promotion using a new defensive formation with one of the best defensive records in League Two, and that last season we weren’t relegated, where is the evidence these guys aren’t good enough for League One? Wootton even went to Wigan and kept them up in the same season.
 

German Shepherd

🚑 Steve Hooper
Oct 2, 2009
1,732
1,261
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Fulwood Lancs
[/quote]
They both starred in the 0-4 home defeat against Rochdale. One of the worst displays at HP last season.

Put it this way. You saw how bad our defence was last season. And Lowe choose to ship them out. So if they aren’t the problem, then Lowe’s judgement must be very questionable because he played Watts almost every game last season.[/quote]

It says something when 4-0 home defeat to Rochdale was one of the worst but not the worst !
 
Mar 14, 2009
5,148
277
Knibbsworth":17aejr3y said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":17aejr3y said:
Knibbsworth":17aejr3y said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":17aejr3y said:
DartingtonPilgrim":17aejr3y said:
gaspargomez":17aejr3y said:
I thought the plan was to sign proven League One defenders ?


The fact is Argyle has only signed one- Wilson from Ipswich.

Scarr and Gillesphey are unproven and untried at League One level. We have been in this situation previously and it hasn’t worked out well.

Proven league one defenders like Canavan and Wootton ?

If you listened to MK Dons and Rochdale fans l remember especially Wootton they warned us they weren’t league one standard.

Nathan Baker from Bristol City would be a decent league one defender. Injury prone but good pedigree. Unfortunately, these type of players cost money.

Players from the division above usually do cost a lot of money. Money we don’t have btw.

Canavan and Wootton were part of a good defence that got out of League Two. It is fashionable to slag them off.

The other defenders we had to compare them to beforehand were Bradley and Vyner, and sadly for the next lads in the door both of those were Championship level defenders. We were lucky to have two at the same time and they made everyone else look poor by comparison.

If Canavan was as crap as some make out, then why did we miss him so much when he went to Bradford?

Have a look at our form after January after Wootton and Canavan went, and it doesn’t support the judgement that they were the problem.

The same Canavan that played in 38 games in league one under Adams and helped to get us relegated. If he wasn’t part of the problem then lm not sure what was.

As for Wootton we all saw enough of him. He tried. He gave everything. Yet he wasn’t as good as Canavan. The same Canavan, who with Edwards, allowed us to have shipped in 80 league one goals.

The only reason why Canavan and Wootton would be looked back with any fondness was because how bad Apoku and Watts were in the final few months.

They both starred in the 0-4 home defeat against Rochdale. One of the worst displays at HP last season.

Put it this way. You saw how bad our defence was last season. And Lowe choose to ship them out. So if they aren’t the problem, then Lowe’s judgement must be very questionable because he played Watts almost every game last season.

“Helped us get relegated”. What an odd phrase.

Teams can only compete at any level when they are all pulling in the same direction, and for reasons unknown that wasn’t the case. Players downed tools for Adams and not many on here know the specifics, myself included.

However to blame exclusively Canavan and Wootton for the relegation season is a little bizarre. (Especially when Wootton wasn’t even really playing.)

Do you use the same argument to decide Lameiras, Ladapo and Carey couldn’t really cut it at League One level? Of course you wouldn’t.

When you consider DA’s team shouldn’t have got relegated on 50 points (but for that awful dressing room capitulation), that under Lowe they won promotion using a new defensive formation with one of the best defensive records in League Two, and that last season we weren’t relegated, where is the evidence these guys aren’t good enough for League One? Wootton even went to Wigan and kept them up in the same season.

Where did l blame them exclusively? If you noticed, l used the phrase “part of the problem”. Canavan was part of a league one defence that conceded 80 league goals. You still claim we shouldn’t of get relegated. Even though our performances defensively for months on end under Adams were terrible. There were signs. Unfortunately, you stuck your head in the sand and choose to ignore it.

I just said they weren’t good enough league one defenders. End of.

As for “helped us to get relegated”. Contributed to us getting relegated then. It’s only an odd phrase because you need to deflect the bizarreness of you defending their league one abilities.
 
Mar 21, 2010
1,739
675
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Plymouth
Knibbsworth":2i0luoix said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":2i0luoix said:
Knibbsworth":2i0luoix said:
Metal_Green_Mickey":2i0luoix said:
DartingtonPilgrim":2i0luoix said:
gaspargomez":2i0luoix said:
I thought the plan was to sign proven League One defenders ?


The fact is Argyle has only signed one- Wilson from Ipswich.

Scarr and Gillesphey are unproven and untried at League One level. We have been in this situation previously and it hasn’t worked out well.

Proven league one defenders like Canavan and Wootton ?

If you listened to MK Dons and Rochdale fans l remember especially Wootton they warned us they weren’t league one standard.

Nathan Baker from Bristol City would be a decent league one defender. Injury prone but good pedigree. Unfortunately, these type of players cost money.

Players from the division above usually do cost a lot of money. Money we don’t have btw.

Canavan and Wootton were part of a good defence that got out of League Two. It is fashionable to slag them off.

The other defenders we had to compare them to beforehand were Bradley and Vyner, and sadly for the next lads in the door both of those were Championship level defenders. We were lucky to have two at the same time and they made everyone else look poor by comparison.

If Canavan was as crap as some make out, then why did we miss him so much when he went to Bradford?

Have a look at our form after January after Wootton and Canavan went, and it doesn’t support the judgement that they were the problem.

The same Canavan that played in 38 games in league one under Adams and helped to get us relegated. If he wasn’t part of the problem then lm not sure what was.

As for Wootton we all saw enough of him. He tried. He gave everything. Yet he wasn’t as good as Canavan. The same Canavan, who with Edwards, allowed us to have shipped in 80 league one goals.

The only reason why Canavan and Wootton would be looked back with any fondness was because how bad Apoku and Watts were in the final few months.

They both starred in the 0-4 home defeat against Rochdale. One of the worst displays at HP last season.

Put it this way. You saw how bad our defence was last season. And Lowe choose to ship them out. So if they aren’t the problem, then Lowe’s judgement must be very questionable because he played Watts almost every game last season.

“Helped us get relegated”. What an odd phrase.

Teams can only compete at any level when they are all pulling in the same direction, and for reasons unknown that wasn’t the case. Players downed tools for Adams and not many on here know the specifics, myself included.

However to blame exclusively Canavan and Wootton for the relegation season is a little bizarre. (Especially when Wootton wasn’t even really playing.)

Do you use the same argument to decide Lameiras, Ladapo and Carey couldn’t really cut it at League One level? Of course you wouldn’t.

When you consider DA’s team shouldn’t have got relegated on 50 points (but for that awful dressing room capitulation), that under Lowe they won promotion using a new defensive formation with one of the best defensive records in League Two, and that last season we weren’t relegated, where is the evidence these guys aren’t good enough for League One? Wootton even went to Wigan and kept them up in the same season.

I put the names of Canavan and Wootton forward in response to gaspargomez belief the plan was to recruit proven League One defenders ( which they were ), not to single them out as responsible for our relegation under Adams , the whole team and management share that responsibility . Proven League One defenders are no guarantee that we will not concede goals next season ,just as they were no guarantee in our relegation season. We will find out in the coming months whether our new defence are good enough as a unit in League One and able to keep the goals against column down whilst hopefully contributing some goals at the other end .
 
Mar 14, 2009
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277
DartingtonPilgrim":1q4ni4vq said:
I put the names of Canavan and Wootton forward in response to gaspargomez belief the plan was to recruit proven League One defenders ( which they were ), not to single them out as responsible for our relegation under Adams , the whole team and management share that responsibility . Proven League One defenders are no guarantee that we will not concede goals next season ,just as they were no guarantee in our relegation season. We will find out in the coming months whether our new defence are good enough as a unit in League One and able to keep the goals against column down whilst hopefully contributing some goals at the other end .

Hoping for this too.

Argyle didn’t have much of a attacking set piece threat last season. We need to find a way of scoring some “cheap” goals.
 

davie nine

R.I.P
Jan 23, 2015
7,785
347
77
Plympton
Canavan was certainly culpable in that 4-0 home defeat by Rochdale last season.
However, I think it is fair to point out that one of his problems in the ‘relegation’ season was that, apparently, he had a health issue (diabetes) that had not been properly diagnosed and treated and he ‘soldiered on’ for most of that season despite the illness.
 
Mar 14, 2009
5,148
277
davie nine":25gnx0q9 said:
Canavan was certainly culpable in that 4-0 home defeat by Rochdale last season.
However, I think it is fair to point out that one of his problems in the ‘relegation’ season was that, apparently, he had a health issue (diabetes) that had not been properly diagnosed and treated and he ‘soldiered on’ for most of that season despite the illness.

Totally. Let’s remember though Edwards had his health issues.

So l totally understand.

Yet we seen enough of certain players to see they simply weren’t good enough. We saw them in league two. I was unlucky enough to be at St James Park when Canavan was in the middle of a back 3 that lost 4-0 to City.

In the transfer thread, Knibbsworth stated the following about Bowman. “He is a 29 year old League Two journeyman”.

That same Bowman that ran rings around our back 3 that day.

So if he thinks Bowman is a journeyman it says a lot for Canavan’s ability. And remember that’s at league two level.
 
Apr 20, 2008
4,166
682
Plymouth
Once again, I am obliged to point out that we were consistently better when Canavan played, and people are choosing to remember the one bad game in 10 he used to have with us.

This season, we conceded 1.4 goals per game when he was playing, and 1.8 when he wasn't.

Last season - 1.0 goals conceded when he was playing, 1.6 when he wasn't.

Season before - 1.3 goals conceded when he was playing, 2.3 when he wasn't.

Anyway, welcome Macaulay.