New Grandstand - 2 day public consultation

[Ham Green]

No one has answered my question as to where the car boot sale in the HHP car park will be situated.
At £6 per seller,the loss of this site could mean a loss of between £300-£600 per sunday

Maybe its days are numbered.

Plenty of other places to hold a car boot sale.

 

[Pilgrim28]

Hi. This coming Tuesday. What's on your mind?
14h 14 hours ago
Hi, Will the club recieve any money/profit from the other HHP development e.g. the ice rink or hotel

Wording isn't great but you get the grasp?
14h 14 hours ago
Sent

John P Morgan
Hi. yes question makes total sense. As set out at fans forum there is an agreement in place where club would gain if car park were ever sold. Club would get a share after all costs paid so no big figure expected. Hotel being built on non club land so no club gain here.
14h

Decided to tween John Morgan last night to query to above question and thought it would benefit this thread.

 

[SWTT]

So there's a nominal gain for the club. Gone from the promise of a 10 million quid stand to a 5 million quid loaned refurb.

 

[Tugboat]

I've had time to absorb and reflect and still have the feeling that the bigger interest is that of the commercial development with a refurbed grandstand a sweetener to for the club/council.

I want to like it and have the glass half full vision but something deep inside me is niggling away leaving an acarid taste to it all.

 

[jerryatricjanner]

I do share those concerns a little. I haven't studied the details, just skipped through the thread but what confuses me is that I thought originally we either had a 10 millionish new grandstand and the city a new ice rink provided by JB as part of other agreements or we had a share of profits on HHP or whatever. It now appears that there is likely to be nil or negligible profits or we have a refurbished rather than new stand but in the form of a 30 year loan rather than provided free? Maybe I am being a bit thick or have missed something and there is a simple explanation? Whatever the ins and outs I look forward to seeing the finished refurbishment and improved facilities as that side of the ground and the facilities in and around it have been so lacking for far too many years now.

 

[HC Green]

I do share those concerns a little. I haven't studied the details, just skipped through the thread but what confuses me is that I thought originally we either had a 10 millionish new grandstand and the city a new ice rink provided by JB as part of other agreements or we had a share of profits on HHP or whatever. It now appears that there is likely to be nil or negligible profits or we have a refurbished rather than new stand but in the form of a 30 year loan rather than provided free? Maybe I am being a bit thick or have missed something and there is a simple explanation? Whatever the ins and outs I look forward to seeing the finished refurbishment and improved facilities as that side of the ground and the facilities in and around it have been so lacking for far too many years now.

The commitment made in 2012 is still current.
What has changed is that the proposed development now will not create the windfall profit that the original development would have. So there won't be enough to fund a new grandstand and therefore Argyle will receive 50% of any windfall profit from the development, which because of the type of development now proposed for HHP won't be very much if anything.

 

[The Grumpy Loyal]

I do share those concerns a little. I haven't studied the details, just skipped through the thread but what confuses me is that I thought originally we either had a 10 millionish new grandstand and the city a new ice rink provided by JB as part of other agreements or we had a share of profits on HHP or whatever. It now appears that there is likely to be nil or negligible profits or we have a refurbished rather than new stand but in the form of a 30 year loan rather than provided free? Maybe I am being a bit thick or have missed something and there is a simple explanation? Whatever the ins and outs I look forward to seeing the finished refurbishment and improved facilities as that side of the ground and the facilities in and around it have been so lacking for far too many years now.

The commitment made in 2012 is still current.
What has changed is that the proposed development now will not create the windfall profit that the original development would have. So there won't be enough to fund a new grandstand and therefore Argyle will receive 50% of any windfall profit from the development, which because of the type of development now proposed for HHP won't be very much if anything.

Well after things have gone full circle on this thread, HC Green hits on the point I was making five days ago when talking of the development of the HHP land.....

Build something that gives genuine potential for PAFC to benefit from with regard to the 50% profit share.

The more ambitious the project, the more potential gains PAFC have in the long run.

 

[Argylegames]

The more ambitious the project, the more potential gains PAFC have in the long run.

But only in the windfall profit - which may be zero if no profit is taken. If I recall correctly the HHP land was sold to JB's company pension scheme. (not his own, his company's) If the pension scheme keeps the ownership of the development then there will be no windfall profit.

 

[The Grumpy Loyal]

Well unless any fan is bonkers, surely they'd want a situation whereby the potential windfall for PAFC is significant?

It may not happen in the short or mid-term, but sure as eggs is eggs land value will only ever rise in the longterm. Develop that land to it's full potential and then at some point there will almost certainly come a time when sale of that land and the development on it, will benefit Argyle financially.

 

[Argyle sy]

I do share those concerns a little. I haven't studied the details, just skipped through the thread but what confuses me is that I thought originally we either had a 10 millionish new grandstand and the city a new ice rink provided by JB as part of other agreements or we had a share of profits on HHP or whatever. It now appears that there is likely to be nil or negligible profits or we have a refurbished rather than new stand but in the form of a 30 year loan rather than provided free? Maybe I am being a bit thick or have missed something and there is a simple explanation? Whatever the ins and outs I look forward to seeing the finished refurbishment and improved facilities as that side of the ground and the facilities in and around it have been so lacking for far too many years now.

The commitment made in 2012 is still current.
What has changed is that the proposed development now will not create the windfall profit that the original development would have. So there won't be enough to fund a new grandstand and therefore Argyle will receive 50% of any windfall profit from the development, which because of the type of development now proposed for HHP won't be very much if anything.

Cue the anti-Brent lot with their "i told you so" comments

 

[HC Green]

I do share those concerns a little. I haven't studied the details, just skipped through the thread but what confuses me is that I thought originally we either had a 10 millionish new grandstand and the city a new ice rink provided by JB as part of other agreements or we had a share of profits on HHP or whatever. It now appears that there is likely to be nil or negligible profits or we have a refurbished rather than new stand but in the form of a 30 year loan rather than provided free? Maybe I am being a bit thick or have missed something and there is a simple explanation? Whatever the ins and outs I look forward to seeing the finished refurbishment and improved facilities as that side of the ground and the facilities in and around it have been so lacking for far too many years now.

The commitment made in 2012 is still current.
What has changed is that the proposed development now will not create the windfall profit that the original development would have. So there won't be enough to fund a new grandstand and therefore Argyle will receive 50% of any windfall profit from the development, which because of the type of development now proposed for HHP won't be very much if anything.

Cue the anti-Brent lot with their "i told you so" comments

The ironic thing is that the people on FB moaning about the proposed HHP development potentially not raising much finance for Argyle are the ones that moaned about the original scheme that would have and were jumping for joy when it didn't go ahead.

 

[Greenskin]

I do share those concerns a little. I haven't studied the details, just skipped through the thread but what confuses me is that I thought originally we either had a 10 millionish new grandstand and the city a new ice rink provided by JB as part of other agreements or we had a share of profits on HHP or whatever. It now appears that there is likely to be nil or negligible profits or we have a refurbished rather than new stand but in the form of a 30 year loan rather than provided free? Maybe I am being a bit thick or have missed something and there is a simple explanation? Whatever the ins and outs I look forward to seeing the finished refurbishment and improved facilities as that side of the ground and the facilities in and around it have been so lacking for far too many years now.

The commitment made in 2012 is still current.
What has changed is that the proposed development now will not create the windfall profit that the original development would have. So there won't be enough to fund a new grandstand and therefore Argyle will receive 50% of any windfall profit from the development, which because of the type of development now proposed for HHP won't be very much if anything.

Cue the anti-Brent lot with their "i told you so" comments

The ironic thing is that the people on FB moaning about the proposed HHP development potentially not raising much finance for Argyle are the ones that moaned about the original scheme that would have and were jumping for joy when it didn't go ahead.

The reason that people were "jumping for joy" had nothing to do with any potential income that would have been lost [although IIRC the only income that the club would have received was from the conferencing facility] from the previous proposal and everything to do with some of us believing that Home Park was going to be terminally boxed in with an inadequate capacity especially in comparison to many other former contemporary clubs.

 

[HC Green]

I do share those concerns a little. I haven't studied the details, just skipped through the thread but what confuses me is that I thought originally we either had a 10 millionish new grandstand and the city a new ice rink provided by JB as part of other agreements or we had a share of profits on HHP or whatever. It now appears that there is likely to be nil or negligible profits or we have a refurbished rather than new stand but in the form of a 30 year loan rather than provided free? Maybe I am being a bit thick or have missed something and there is a simple explanation? Whatever the ins and outs I look forward to seeing the finished refurbishment and improved facilities as that side of the ground and the facilities in and around it have been so lacking for far too many years now.

The commitment made in 2012 is still current.
What has changed is that the proposed development now will not create the windfall profit that the original development would have. So there won't be enough to fund a new grandstand and therefore Argyle will receive 50% of any windfall profit from the development, which because of the type of development now proposed for HHP won't be very much if anything.

Cue the anti-Brent lot with their "i told you so" comments

The ironic thing is that the people on FB moaning about the proposed HHP development potentially not raising much finance for Argyle are the ones that moaned about the original scheme that would have and were jumping for joy when it didn't go ahead.

The reason that people were "jumping for joy" had nothing to do with any potential income that would have been lost [although IIRC the only income that the club would have received was from the conferencing facility] from the previous proposal and everything to do with some of us believing that Home Park was going to be terminally boxed in with an inadequate capacity especially in comparison to many other former contemporary clubs.

It always makes me chuckle when people say the development will box/hem in, stop future development of Home Park.

Makes me wonder how does the HHP development prevents future development of the Devonport, Lyndhurst and Barn Park stands.

 

[pedro91]

No one has answered my question as to where the car boot sale in the HHP car park will be situated.
At £6 per seller,the loss of this site could mean a loss of between £300-£600 per sunday

Unless I am missing the point of your question Pedro, that's small beer compared to the benefits of the project as a whole.

Ok so where does the money that is collected from the sellers go,on a good day with all available spaces taken,that could be up to £1k?
If HHP is developed,would any of the profit go where the car boot proceeds go?

 

[dunlop]

Barry why don't you ask the organisers of the car boot when you are next up there if they have any plans for the car boot when the proposed work on HHP starts.