Misery loves company

[Ave IT]

Isn't it simply a case that there is bound to be many different viewpoints, theories, nuances of opinion about why something isn't working and suggestions for how to remedy it compared to when things are going well?? If we're winning and playing good football we're all likely to be in agreement that it is..... errr......quite good and we're happy......Not exactly a recipe for debate is it?

As Doc says - it's perfectly possible to watch the football and enjoy it and have some perspective yet still want to get involved in arguments about what should or shouldn't be done fix things. In some ways coming on a football thread to say "yeah - it's great and I agree with everyone else it's great" is less appealing than wanting to know what others think when things are not so good. Don't get me wrong - it is tiresome reading angry, knee-jerk rants from people wanting to get their frustrations off their chests but you can just skim over those and you soon get to know posters with more considered views.

 

[Pogleswoody]

There's only one thing worse than moaners, and that's people who moan about moaners. Though even they aren't as bad as the people who moan about about moaners moaning about moaners.

Spare a thought for groaners, painfully neglected at times.

Problem on Saturday is social distancing, all the moaners and groaners will be loners. :sad:

 

[Bezza]

Definitely people post more when we lose. Its the same on all football club forums and on social media in general you get more negative postings and positive. For example look at any owners club devoted to a particular car. There are tons of threads devoted to the issues that develop when cars go wrong, but you never see someone put a post on that their car is reliable, which is probably the majority.

I find it interesting that people go so overboard these days when the team loses and I think its a combination of modern instant gratification thinking combined with social media giving people a public forum for their anger/frustration. It makes me laugh when, like Tuesday night, people post stuff like "That's the worse performance I've seen in my 40 years watching argyle". When you consider the number of seasons Argyle have spent in the basement division during the past 25 years and the thrashings they suffered during the relegation years of 1994/95, 1998/99, 2009/10 etc, it is a bit of an over-reaction, but that seems to be the way it is these days. People are passionate and the hear and now overcomes any rational perspective.

I think the Brits are also by nature a fairly dour bunch compared with our european cousins so all things combined, its no surprise really that much knashing of teeth is seen after every loss and not much discussion after a win!

 

[mervyn]

Be thankful you’re not Spanish. I have family in Barcelona who support Tottenham and Barca. Apparently if Barca win comfortably, but the team plays with insufficient flair or imagination, then the local moaning and groaning is worse than a defeat by a better side. They also apparently spend most of the game listening to the commentary on the radio and chatting amongst themselves until there’s any goalmouth action.

 

[arrythewurzel]

I just think there’s more to discuss when things go wrong and there is greater analysis of the decision making of coaches and players.

Take Tuesday - first goal potentially offside. Second goal potentially out of play. Canavan not playing to whistle. Was third goal keepers or Wootton’s fault. Why is Camara not first on the team sheet. Mass substitutions right? Lowe’s resigned demeanour on the bench. Do we have a plan B. Where’s Danny. Where’s the £1m rated striker when we’re looking toothless. Tuesday night defeat under the lights again. Players disposition from start. Another thumping ? Why? There’s so much more to discuss on a Tuesday like the one just gone that a 1-0 win wouldn’t have provoked and it’s the same in most defeats I’d beg to say.

 

[philevs]

I just think there’s more to discuss when things go wrong and there is greater analysis of the decision making of coaches and players.

Take Tuesday - first goal potentially offside. Second goal potentially out of play. Canavan not playing to whistle. Was third goal keepers or Wootton’s fault. Why is Camara not first on the team sheet. Mass substitutions right? Lowe’s resigned demeanour on the bench. Do we have a plan B. Where’s Danny. Where’s the £1m rated striker when we’re looking toothless. Tuesday night defeat under the lights again. Players disposition from start. Another thumping ? Why? There’s so much more to discuss on a Tuesday like the one just gone that a 1-0 win wouldn’t have provoked and it’s the same in most defeats I’d beg to say.

Yes I think that’s right.

 

[Quintrell Green]

There's only one thing worse than moaners, and that's people who moan about moaners. Though even they aren't as bad as the people who moan about about moaners moaning about moaners.

Spare a thought for groaners, painfully neglected at times.

Problem on Saturday is social distancing, all the moaners and groaners will be loners. :sad:

Better than being a goner, I reckon

 

[justanotherfan]

My first experience of Home Park was in either 1953 or 1954 although I have no recollection of it, I have seen matches and seasons which were so bad as to invoke a feeling of never again and I have also been treated to displays that make me think that God is a Green. I have stood among 40000 or more and been a member of the "faithful five thousand", in fact on Saturday I will count amongst the lucky 1808. I fully expect to see games worse than Tuesday and better than QPR and all things in between. I love football at this level because of the uncertainty of it, I imagine being a Manure fan in their pomp must have become somewhat predictable, oh well another victory, another league title, roll on next season. Ryan Lowe will either sort thing out or he won`t but their is nothing I can do about that, so onwards and upwards - hopefully.

 

[demportdave]

More sanctimonious claptrap and psycho-babble criticising Argyle fans.

Having a moan on PASOTI in the immediate aftermath of a totally unexpected and shocking home defeat against a side without a win in 7 games is hardly surprising.

A few short weeks ago on the back of a few home wins, some fans were talking about the Play-offs or even automatic promotion. The people criticising the supposedly negative fans now were not critical of the rather over-enthusiatic fans then.

But lets keep it in context, after 9 successive League Championships and umpteen domestic Cup wins, Celtic players and officials had to be ushered out of Parkhead via the back door on Sunday to avoid their own rioting fans after their recent poor run culminated in a 2-1 home defeat in the League Cup against Ross County. Having a bit of a moan on a website is quite tame by comparison.

Go back to the times when we were actually attending games, dependent on the result, we would be praising/berating the team and the Manager all of the way home but by about mid-evening, our passion and/or excitement would have cooled and we would see things in a more balanced and reasoned way.

Its just human nature to over-react one way or the other in the moments immediately after the game and say things you might not say later. I can't think of a more intelligent, articulate or cerebal person in football than Arsene Wenger, but some of his post-match interviews were ridiculous.

 

[justanotherfan]

More sanctimonious claptrap and psycho-babble criticising Argyle fans.

Having a moan on PASOTI in the immediate aftermath of a totally unexpected and shocking home defeat against a side without a win in 7 games is hardly surprising.

A few short weeks ago on the back of a few home wins, some fans were talking about the Play-offs or even automatic promotion. The people criticising the supposedly negative fans now were not critical of the rather over-enthusiatic fans then.

But lets keep it in context, after 9 successive League Championships and umpteen domestic Cup wins, Celtic players and officials had to be ushered out of Parkhead via the back door on Sunday to avoid their own rioting fans after their recent poor run culminated in a 2-1 home defeat in the League Cup against Ross County. Having a bit of a moan on a website is quite tame by comparison.

Go back to the times when we were actually attending games, dependent on the result, we would be praising/berating the team and the Manager all of the way home but by about mid-evening, our passion and/or excitement would have cooled and we would see things in a more balanced and reasoned way.

Its just human nature to over-react one way or the other in the moments immediately after the game and say things you might not say later. I can't think of a more intelligent, articulate or cerebal person in football than Arsene Wenger, but some of his post-match interviews were ridiculous.

I feel sure I have not criticised fellow supporters or at least it wasn`t my intention.

 

[oldage]

Hmmmmm....

I often find if you make constructive criticism when your winning you will be questioned why your not happy.

I also tend to find that comments are mostly picked up and noticed after defeats.

I try to stay consistent when l post. When we were winning and near the playoffs it didn’t feel right to me. Games were won but l can’t say it was convincing. Yet a number we’re talking about the playoffs and l kept thinking are they watching the same game as me. Sure it’s great to win but the performances need to be convincing in order to believe your position is sustainable. Too many games were played where l kept watching us concede guilt edge chances and the opposition didn’t take them. In the last few games they have.

I’m not too disheartened. I believe at some stage of the season we would be pulled into the relegation battle. I am hoping the positive mindset of our manager will mean that we can pick up enough wins during the course of this season where we can keep clear of the bottom four. I think 14th - 17th this season was realistic.

I don’t think it’s misery at all. I mean sure some love to just be negative full stop. I just thing it’s realism kicking in and we are currently seeing how difficult it is to play attacking football without having the right blend of players to pull it off.

When we win. People go overboard. When we lose. People go overboard. Either way emotions run high. It’s what makes social media platforms so compelling. The platform to display your emotions. Sometimes that’s good and other times not.

I think 19pts at this stage of the season is still OK. Currently with Lowe lm waiting to see how he adapts his tactics to life in league one. Until then we won’t know if he is as good as we all hoped he would be.

Well put. My feelings in a nutshell. :thumbup:

 

[oldage]

More sanctimonious claptrap and psycho-babble criticising Argyle fans.

Having a moan on PASOTI in the immediate aftermath of a totally unexpected and shocking home defeat against a side without a win in 7 games is hardly surprising.

A few short weeks ago on the back of a few home wins, some fans were talking about the Play-offs or even automatic promotion. The people criticising the supposedly negative fans now were not critical of the rather over-enthusiatic fans then.

But lets keep it in context, after 9 successive League Championships and umpteen domestic Cup wins, Celtic players and officials had to be ushered out of Parkhead via the back door on Sunday to avoid their own rioting fans after their recent poor run culminated in a 2-1 home defeat in the League Cup against Ross County. Having a bit of a moan on a website is quite tame by comparison.

Go back to the times when we were actually attending games, dependent on the result, we would be praising/berating the team and the Manager all of the way home but by about mid-evening, our passion and/or excitement would have cooled and we would see things in a more balanced and reasoned way.

Its just human nature to over-react one way or the other in the moments immediately after the game and say things you might not say later. I can't think of a more intelligent, articulate or cerebal person in football than Arsene Wenger, but some of his post-match interviews were ridiculous.

Well said :thumbup:

 

[Antipodean]

I noticed a trend on here that there seem to be a lot more active posters (or at least more posts) when we are losing than when we are winning. So I crunched some numbers about the match threads from our competitive games this season.

The average number of pages on the threads is:

20 pages when we lose
17.5 pages when we draw (skewed by that crazy Wimbledon game - 26 pages!)
12.6 pages when we win.

Longest thread: 30 pages vs Rochdale.
Shortest thread: 8 pages vs Northampton.

Not sure what point I'm making, if any, but thought it was an interesting reflection.

Thanks for doing that - some evidence to back up an impression. A bit like the domination of good news by bad news in journalism. Having a moan and going over the top about football is a common pleasure, but it's generally more palatable when people are in the same room or on the terraces. In a context like PASOTI, it's text-based and most people don't know each other except through the evidence of the page. The majority would just be lurkers, reading without posting.

This means - and there is plenty of academic and industry research on the subject - that a small cohort of commenters provides most of the posts. Encouraged by an unaccustomed wider profile, they'll push their barrows ad nauseum and are not too bothered about the types of commenting etiquette rule that Plymouth Live has tried but clearly failed to sustain. Quite a lot of the discussion involves commenters insulting each other, as if the others online are caught up in some private spat.

So, yes, 'misery loves company' and miseries love digital megaphones. The Argyle Fans Forum would be a more engaging space if those who like to sound off had some awareness that their (mostly) poorly expressed tirades reflect less favourably on themselves than on their usual targets.

 

[Koala Green]

I noticed a trend on here that there seem to be a lot more active posters (or at least more posts) when we are losing than when we are winning. So I crunched some numbers about the match threads from our competitive games this season.

The average number of pages on the threads is:

20 pages when we lose
17.5 pages when we draw (skewed by that crazy Wimbledon game - 26 pages!)
12.6 pages when we win.

Longest thread: 30 pages vs Rochdale.
Shortest thread: 8 pages vs Northampton.

Not sure what point I'm making, if any, but thought it was an interesting reflection.

Thanks for doing that - some evidence to back up an impression. A bit like the domination of good news by bad news in journalism. Having a moan and going over the top about football is a common pleasure, but it's generally more palatable when people are in the same room or on the terraces. In a context like PASOTI, it's text-based and most people don't know each other except through the evidence of the page. The majority would just be lurkers, reading without posting.

This means - and there is plenty of academic and industry research on the subject - that a small cohort of commenters provides most of the posts. Encouraged by an unaccustomed wider profile, they'll push their barrows ad nauseum and are not too bothered about the types of commenting etiquette rule that Plymouth Live has tried but clearly failed to sustain. Quite a lot of the discussion involves commenters insulting each other, as if the others online are caught up in some private spat.

So, yes, 'misery loves company' and miseries love digital megaphones. The Argyle Fans Forum would be a more engaging space if those who like to sound off had some awareness that their (mostly) poorly expressed tirades reflect less favourably on themselves than on their usual targets.

Excellent posts from Lobster and Antipodean, agree with points made. I think the Pasoti forum would be a much healthier place if the people who generally read and don't post contributed more. On this thread alone I see a lot of new people who have not contributed before, it is great to hear new and different perspectives. Personally I have been one of those passive forum members for a long time and while I appreciate much of what is said on here as ultimately we are all Argyle fans, I think sometimes this can over represent the views of a minority rather than the majority.

I do believe that the sentiment on Pasoti even when the club and team are doing really well is pessimistic, we seem happier when moaning rather than enjoying the high points!..which there have been a lot of these past 2 seasons. Having followed Argyle for 40 years, the high points should be savoured as they don't akways last - Dave Smith years, FA Cup, Dalton/Buszaky/ Friio, Ebanks Blake, Sturrock #1, Holloway, Adams promotion, Carey/Lamerias, Lowe promotion , Mayor Hallett ownership etc.

 

[Aussam]

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