The Banton/Thomas debate

[Jasa]

Simple question, 3 options really.

I can't remember the last time a crowd at HP came down so hard on a particular player, received a lot of abuse from the stands, it wasn't his worst display but it was the lack of effort getting on everyone's nerves. After such a promising pre season, Banton has been a massive flop.

I'm not the biggest Thomas fan but the game was crying out for him & so were the stands, in honesty, I think the chanting of his name actually decreased the chances of him coming on due to Sheridan not being able to swallow pride. Thomas seems irritated on twitter especially, I'd be extremely frustrated if I was on the touchline every match with Banton underperforming.

I'd start with Morgan on the left in a 3 man attack with Reid in the middle & Lewi on the right. But if it was a straight choice between Thomas & Banton, I'd say Thomas at the moment, at least I think he'd be hungry.

How do you know Banton is 'lacking effort'? I think his work rate has been very good this season in comparison to previous years. Did you miss his defensive duties he's started putting in this season? Just because he doesn't run for 90 minutes, it doesn't mean he isn't trying. Yes he's been poor on the ball for a player of his standard however he seems a confidence player. All of this will not held the guy through his rough patch.

Thomas is more direct when he plays. He runs at the man with pace however this can lead to him losing the ball and a counter attack being on.

Also can you stop mentioning that Sheridan isn't bringing on Thomas because the fans chanted his name! You make it sound like Thomas was all warmed up ready to go, Sheridan heard the fans chant Thomas' name and said "Sit back down Nathan, I'm not doing what the fans tell me to do!" :facepalm:

 

[Lesley Somerville]

I hate to say it but the 'lazy' moniker seems to get applied only to non-white players, at least by certain people. Racial stereotyping run very deep. Maybe worth stopping and thinking carefully before using such subjective and ill-considered descriptions in future.

 

[Nobby]

I hate to say it but the 'lazy' moniker seems to get applied only to non-white players, at least by certain people. Racial stereotyping run very deep. Maybe worth stopping and thinking carefully before using such subjective and ill-considered descriptions in future.

:wtf: :wtf: can't say that i've ever noticed that, ever.

 

[Lesley Somerville]

I have. My main point is that using terms like 'lazy' is in itself lazy!

 

[IJN]

Mmmm, never noticed that Lesley and I'm proud to say that.

Lazy? I can think of Capaldi, Maclean and Gow who were called that. Not exactly from the West Indies are they?

 

[Cobi Budge.]

I hate to say it but the 'lazy' moniker seems to get applied only to non-white players, at least by certain people. Racial stereotyping run very deep. Maybe worth stopping and thinking carefully before using such subjective and ill-considered descriptions in future.

If you are implying that I used the word 'lazy' when describing Banton because he isn't white, then I find that a tad insulting to be honest.

I can't say I've ever noticed what you are saying, in this country anyway.

 

[pilgrimmike1]

I hate to say it but the 'lazy' moniker seems to get applied only to non-white players, at least by certain people. Racial stereotyping run very deep. Maybe worth stopping and thinking carefully before using such subjective and ill-considered descriptions in future.

If you are implying that I used the word 'lazy' when describing Banton because he isn't white, then I find that a tad insulting to be honest.

I can't say I've ever noticed what you are saying, in this country anyway.

Trigger was called everything bar a christian on here.

 

[GreenSam]

I hate to say it but the 'lazy' moniker seems to get applied only to non-white players, at least by certain people. Racial stereotyping run very deep. Maybe worth stopping and thinking carefully before using such subjective and ill-considered descriptions in future.

I agree with that, Lesley.

I'm not accusing anyone of ever purposefully or consciously using it for that reason but I do think it happens a little bit too disproportionately for it to be explained by the laws of averages.

 

[IJN]

So WHAT are you saying Sam?

 

[GreenSam]

I'm saying that subconscious stereotypes that have been fettered through society often come out into speech and thoughts as often as conscious decisions do.

 

[Josh Pope]

Is there not just the chance that non-white players are lazier? Not as a stereotype, just the ones we've come across. I can think of plenty for each skin colour actually, so I'm quite confused by that comment.

 

[GreenSam]

Reid was occasionally called lazy when even when he was trying he was anything but. Banton this season has been called lazy when his workrate has notably improved. Again let me clear this is by some, not by all.

It's important to keep this in perspective here. No-one's saying we've got KKK representatives in our fanbase here or anything. No-one's saying we've got supporters who'd jeer anyone for being black. It's not about hounding people out or anything like that. It's about the societal factors not the personal factors. I just seem to think that sometimes non-white players are called lazy when in fact they aren't. Reid and Banton are two examples. Ebanks-Blake and Wright-Phillips are two more I could say.

There's no denying it's something that has happened in football generally. Commentators are often full of ethnic stereotypes for certain nationalities. 'Organised' East Asian players, 'scattered' African players, 'flair' filled South American players. Do these stereotypes exist in a vacuum of society or do they have a drip, drip, drip affect. I think it's the latter. There are all sorts of studies showing how psychological descriptions can create 'coding' within the part of the brain which makes decisions- maybe it's something like that.

To be absolutely clear, I'm not saying this is something Argyle specific at all.

 

[IJN]

It's good to know you are including the whole of football rather than single out Argyle in this left wing utter nonsense Sam.

The last time I heard anything like this, I had a row with the person and I've never seen or talked to her since.

 

[GreenSam]

Of course it's not just an Argyle thing- my entire point is that stuff doesn't exist in a bubble.

There's a racism problem in the world, therefore there's a racism problem in football, therefore there's a racism problem in...the list can go narrower and narrower and narrower. It's not about digging people out it's about questioning where certain thoughts or concepts come from and why that is.

I don't mean to upset anybody- I just think that whilst racial stereotypes become so embedded into society it'd be surprising if none of them filtered through.

 

[argyle1990]

Considering that Banton has played as a left mid for Palace, Arsenal, Spurs, Blackburn, Leicester and Liverpool he seems fairly poor as a left mid.