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Drainage Problem/No Contract signed.

memory man

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signalspast":1mo45a8u said:
Anybody who has had the dubious pleasure of smelling the old grandstand toilets over the years would realise there is drainage problems somewhere in the system. There is probably decades of tish to unblock somewhere
I don't know the history of this alleged drainage problem but I would think it is highly likely that any drainage system installed in the immediate post-war period would struggle to be fit for purpose more than 60 years later. When older buildings undergo significant updating it is not unusual to find emergent problems with the supporting infrastructure.
 
Jan 8, 2006
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Quizmike":2uiaxxtx said:
God have I had enough of this. We are in a bubble here...if the club released a statement about drains, 99% of supporters would be "WTF - why are they telling me about drains?".

Pasoti may be a bit of a bubble, but free chat isn't. Argyle fans scroll FB all day long, and when a very small cabal of users bombard an Argyle page with crap day after day - some may start to believe half of the poo.

People mention something called 'Pasoti fact', as something of a rumour that becomes established as fact. Well Free Chat is 100% worse for this.

So while some may feel the club have no need to comment on trivial matters, unfortunately they do.
 

Pogleswoody

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memory man":1wcavz7u said:
signalspast":1wcavz7u said:
Anybody who has had the dubious pleasure of smelling the old grandstand toilets over the years would realise there is drainage problems somewhere in the system. There is probably decades of tish to unblock somewhere
I don't know the history of this alleged drainage problem but I would think it is highly likely that any drainage system installed in the immediate post-war period would struggle to be fit for purpose more than 60 years later. When older buildings undergo significant updating it is not unusual to find emergent problems with the supporting infrastructure.


two words: Pitch Fibre :shock:
:lol:
 

Georgieboy

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Stuart House":10t177pl said:
Quizmike":10t177pl said:
God have I had enough of this. We are in a bubble here...if the club released a statement about drains, 99% of supporters would be "WTF - why are they telling me about drains?".

Pasoti may be a bit of a bubble, but free chat isn't. Argyle fans scroll FB all day long, and when a very small cabal of users bombard an Argyle page with crap day after day - some may start to believe half of the sh1te.

People mention something called 'Pasoti fact', as something of a rumour that becomes established as fact. Well Free Chat is 100% worse for this.

So while some may feel the club have no need to comment on trivial matters, unfortunately they do.
Well said Stu, once again Argyle have kept everything under cover.This is the way business should be conducted. They will release a statement when the board are ready. Donald Trump said he would like to invest some money but said he he couldn't find an airport in Plymouth to land his jet. So he will not invest and flew to see his new mate Mr Putin!! :funny:
 

memory man

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Pogleswoody":7fcms8bj said:
memory man":7fcms8bj said:
signalspast":7fcms8bj said:
Anybody who has had the dubious pleasure of smelling the old grandstand toilets over the years would realise there is drainage problems somewhere in the system. There is probably decades of tish to unblock somewhere
I don't know the history of this alleged drainage problem but I would think it is highly likely that any drainage system installed in the immediate post-war period would struggle to be fit for purpose more than 60 years later. When older buildings undergo significant updating it is not unusual to find emergent problems with the supporting infrastructure.


two words: Pitch Fibre :shock:
:lol:
Ah, sold plenty of that when I worked for CE Curtis at Laira Bridge 1964/1965 and loads of tarred gaskin too. It was quite a change from the traditional 4" collared clay pipes which in those days were glazed inside and out.
 

IJN

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justanotherfan":2z1x5tcj said:
My only interest as a fare paying passenger is the line up and result on August 4th and the drain on my pension. :twisted: :twisted:

Exactly the way it should be!!

:scarf:
 

Emu

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memory man":3cfrcxyg said:
Pogleswoody":3cfrcxyg said:
memory man":3cfrcxyg said:
signalspast":3cfrcxyg said:
Anybody who has had the dubious pleasure of smelling the old grandstand toilets over the years would realise there is drainage problems somewhere in the system. There is probably decades of tish to unblock somewhere
I don't know the history of this alleged drainage problem but I would think it is highly likely that any drainage system installed in the immediate post-war period would struggle to be fit for purpose more than 60 years later. When older buildings undergo significant updating it is not unusual to find emergent problems with the supporting infrastructure.


two words: Pitch Fibre :shock:
:lol:
Ah, sold plenty of that when I worked for CE Curtis at Laira Bridge 1964/1965 and loads of tarred gaskin too. It was quite a change from the traditional 4" collared clay pipes which in those days were glazed inside and out.


For those of us with a lack of pitch fibre knowledge. :lol:

"Pitch fibre drainage pipes were introduced in the 1940s, and used extensively until the 1970s. They were thought at the time to be the latest wonder material, being cheaper than fired clay pipes, and also lightweight and easy to handle. They were made from wood fibre impregnated with coal tar, and have performed adequately when dealing with normal waste water. However, they have been found to react badly when subjected to large quantities of hot water, and to oils and fats, which can soften the tar and cause deformation and leaks. The design life of pitch fibre pipes was recently estimated to be about 40 years, meaning that some will have reached the end of their life expectancy. In the worst cases, they can collapse, blocking the drain run.


The small delaminations that you describe would seem to indicate that your own drains are not badly affected, though, and may have a good few years life in them. You have not said why you had the CCTV drain survey undertaken, however, and if it was because you have already had a blockage, then it may be wise to consider remedial action. Clearly, digging a trench and laying a new drain would be the most professional job, but since this would involve excavating and re-laying your concrete drive, it will be expensive and disruptive. It might be worth investigating whether the old drain runs could be abandoned, and new drains laid alongside the drive.

If this is not possible, then drain lining has a good reputation, and the price you have been quoted sounds reasonable. Delaminated and collapsed pitch-fibre pipes can be forced back into shape with a re-rounding tool dragged through them, and the resin-impregnated polyester textile liner is designed to be strong enough to withstand further movement. Before you do anything, it might also be worth checking with your insurer, as there have been cases where insurers have paid for drain renewal under "accidental damage" claims"

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/lifestyle/i ... drain.html
 

Neath Green

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I rarely post on here but I am an avid reader. I have read with amusement the consternation over the fact that a contract has not been signed. As a Chartered Civil engineer with over 35years in construction I can tell you that this far more common than people think. It is not uncommon to be commence work on a project under a letter of intent until the final T and C's of the contract are agreed. In fact a PO can be issued to cover start up costs and enabling works. Our company has only just signed the contract for a 5 year framework with a major national client some 6 months into the start of the contract having worked on a award letter and initial PO.
I have no knowledge of what is happening behind the scenes at PAFC this is only my view and assumption. I guess that the contract will be NEC Option C or D which is target cost. Until all the designs are signed off and costs agreed then the contract will not be signed by the contractor, as such the drainage issue could be one of the reasons why the contract is not signed. It is not something that I am at all concerned about because I would have no doubt that all concerned will be working to resolve issues asap.
 

Biggs

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And that’s the kind of expert opinion that we needed to cut through the conspiracy nonsense on other sites.

Thanks!
 
Jan 8, 2006
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Neath Green":ea7izq4y said:
I rarely post on here but I am an avid reader. I have read with amusement the consternation over the fact that a contract has not been signed. As a Chartered Civil engineer with over 35years in construction I can tell you that this far more common than people think. It is not uncommon to be commence work on a project under a letter of intent until the final T and C's of the contract are agreed. In fact a PO can be issued to cover start up costs and enabling works. Our company has only just signed the contract for a 5 year framework with a major national client some 6 months into the start of the contract having worked on a award letter and initial PO.
I have no knowledge of what is happening behind the scenes at PAFC this is only my view and assumption. I guess that the contract will be NEC Option C or D which is target cost. Until all the designs are signed off and costs agreed then the contract will not be signed by the contractor, as such the drainage issue could be one of the reasons why the contract is not signed. It is not something that I am at all concerned about because I would have no doubt that all concerned will be working to resolve issues asap.

Ah some one who knows what they are talking about. Unfortunately I don't think such expert opinion will deter some.
 
Oct 24, 2010
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Neath Green":1ts49uw6 said:
I rarely post on here but I am an avid reader. I have read with amusement the consternation over the fact that a contract has not been signed. As a Chartered Civil engineer with over 35years in construction I can tell you that this far more common than people think. It is not uncommon to be commence work on a project under a letter of intent until the final T and C's of the contract are agreed. In fact a PO can be issued to cover start up costs and enabling works. Our company has only just signed the contract for a 5 year framework with a major national client some 6 months into the start of the contract having worked on a award letter and initial PO.
I have no knowledge of what is happening behind the scenes at PAFC this is only my view and assumption. I guess that the contract will be NEC Option C or D which is target cost. Until all the designs are signed off and costs agreed then the contract will not be signed by the contractor, as such the drainage issue could be one of the reasons why the contract is not signed. It is not something that I am at all concerned about because I would have no doubt that all concerned will be working to resolve issues asap.
My guess is that the works would be carried out under a JCT Design and Build Contract but, I agree, the points you make are valid, the most likely cause of any delay in signing the contract would be incomplete design information in which circumstance both parties would be loathe to enter into an agreement. Apart from any other design shortfalls PCC’s Civil Engineer has asked for more information to discharge the drainage planning condition and until that is finalised, as you say, it would not be possible to agree a final cost of the drainage works.

It is the construction industry and all this is quite normal but I do agree with some earlier posts that more communication from the club would be much appreciated.
 

PL2 3DQ

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Stuart House":23mlx4kn said:
Quizmike":23mlx4kn said:
God have I had enough of this. We are in a bubble here...if the club released a statement about drains, 99% of supporters would be "WTF - why are they telling me about drains?".

Pasoti may be a bit of a bubble, but free chat isn't. Argyle fans scroll FB all day long, and when a very small cabal of users bombard an Argyle page with crap day after day - some may start to believe half of the sh1te.

People mention something called 'Pasoti fact', as something of a rumour that becomes established as fact. Well Free Chat is 100% worse for this.

So while some may feel the club have no need to comment on trivial matters, unfortunately they do.

Plenty of interested people read Pasoti for a balanced view, there's currently 1700 reading which includes 1400 guests.
 

Neath Green

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esmer":1fsidwkp said:
Neath Green":1fsidwkp said:
I rarely post on here but I am an avid reader. I have read with amusement the consternation over the fact that a contract has not been signed. As a Chartered Civil engineer with over 35years in construction I can tell you that this far more common than people think. It is not uncommon to be commence work on a project under a letter of intent until the final T and C's of the contract are agreed. In fact a PO can be issued to cover start up costs and enabling works. Our company has only just signed the contract for a 5 year framework with a major national client some 6 months into the start of the contract having worked on a award letter and initial PO.
I have no knowledge of what is happening behind the scenes at PAFC this is only my view and assumption. I guess that the contract will be NEC Option C or D which is target cost. Until all the designs are signed off and costs agreed then the contract will not be signed by the contractor, as such the drainage issue could be one of the reasons why the contract is not signed. It is not something that I am at all concerned about because I would have no doubt that all concerned will be working to resolve issues asap.
My guess is that the works would be carried out under a JCT Design and Build Contract but, I agree, the points you make are valid, the most likely cause of any delay in signing the contract would be incomplete design information in which circumstance both parties would be loathe to enter into an agreement. Apart from any other design shortfalls PCC’s Civil Engineer has asked for more information to discharge the drainage planning condition and until that is finalised, as you say, it would not be possible to agree a final cost of the drainage works.

It is the construction industry and all this is quite normal but I do agree with some earlier posts that more communication from the club would be much appreciated.

Esmer, You are right I forgot as it is building works it will be more likely the JCT contract. Also I totally agree that the club should be forthcoming with communicating with the fanbase . And yes this is quite a normal occurrence within the construction industry.
 

IJN

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Kentishgreen":241fsx5k said:
So are they expected to respond to allegations that certain photographs have been photoshopped? FFS

:lol: Kentish, do what I do block the site. It's a nest of vipers in so many ways.

The originator of it went from here because we no longer need a 'voice of Argyle' and it's gone downhill from there.