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Stoke Brief Synopsis sponsored by Bromleigh House

Sep 3, 2009
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MGM has nailed it, as usual.

To flame these players is to be blind to the gulf in resources with most clubs in this division.

Stoke are a massively underachieving squad who clicked today.

Ultimately, we were 2nd best but at 0-0 it looked at times like we might sneak ahead. Had that happened, it would have played out very differently, perhaps.

This game was always going to have a special type of focus. Glad it is done to be honest.

It’s in our own hands - very much so - with 2 games to go. I’m optimistic. 21st will be a great achievement if we make it.
 
Apr 30, 2011
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Refusal to acknowledge the limitations of our players.

Foster may of destroyed dressing room morale. He didn't destroy the ability of many of these players.

What on earth were some of you expecting? To turn Jordan Houghton into a championship midfielder. To make Dan Scarr a yard quicker in body & mind so he isn't a league one defender.

Last week we beat Leicester playing almost 6 across the back and holding on for dear life. Within the win, people still can't see our limitations so end up getting annoyed at witnessing games like we seen today.

The players are putting in the effort. It's their lack of ability at this level that is being found out. That second half was the level of our current team. They tried. They just can't engage their footballing brains with their technical ability.

How can you honestly be disappointed if you believed Argyle will finish around 20th this season? And that's where l struggle with the reaction of some because if we didn't have a bottom two budget l would say it's fine to be angry & disappointed. But we do, and we have been playing like we do in many matches this season.

For me, lm more frustrated not with losing the game but losing our footballing idenity. We aren't an attacking side because we don't create many chances. Let alone look like scoring goals. And when we did look like scoring under Schumacher, we give the oppostion the freedom of HP to hurt us.

Last season was great. This season was one step too many for a number of those players. Yet, that was our budget and that is where we are as a club.

The fact is we can survive. We might not. Yet l believe those players have given everything. People rather call them bottle jobs today instead of face the fact they have limited abilities.
Agree with elements of this post but you can't be seriously trying to say that the 2nd half performance is typical for the likes of Randell, Mumba and Houghton etc. They have all played much, much better in other games this season. Randell, Whittaker and Hardi were particularly below par today.q

We can compete with this quality of player but they need to all be on 7/10 at least, or we need tactical alternatives to change the game our way (Schuey smashed this last season). But we don't have those options in the squad right now.

Mr Hallett talks about 'outsmarting' other teams, the key to that is finding 'wee nuggets', finding a way to keep players fit and in decent form as well as having the players to transition tactically to a plan B, or maybe even a C when we are under the cosh.

None of that is unachievable in my eyes. Extremely difficult, yes absolutely. But if we give up on that ideology, that direction, that dream... then what's the point in being an Argyle fan?
 
Oct 14, 2019
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Llantwit Major
I wouldn't be too hard on our players. I think their manager played it perfectly for someone who knows our players well. Their players got in our faces the whole match and that's the way to play Argyle. Mumba was pushed back and nullified, Hardie was locked up and Whitaker was useless. It's not a coincidence that Devine played well. Their manager doesn't know. Our team in hindsight should have been smarter and played all of Foster's players. The loss of Foreshaw hurt us. At least some of the results went in our favour.
 
Aug 4, 2011
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Exactly the same as when we went to Ryan Lowe’s Preston, and as it has been for my 35 years supporting the greens. Outclassed when it mattered in a game where we wanted to prove a point against the opposition. Randell in particular had an awful game, as much as I bigged Hardie up for the past few season I just don’t know what he’s offering at present. You can say he needs a rest, but he’s just has a clear 7 days off and a 2 week international break before that.

My tune is the same as it was 6 months ago, I think we’ll stay up, but it’ll be close, and mostly because there are 3 worse teams than us. Rotherham and Huddersfield look like 2, just who the other is I’m not quite sure.

I’m not expecting much more than the same again at Millwall next week so this is going down to the wire
 
Jun 27, 2019
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Really disappointed in the team today. I don't mind being beaten by superior quality in this league but today wasn't about that, Stoke just wanted it more.

That's the second time we've lost Forshaw to injury in an away game and then completely crumbled. Randell and Houghton are a mediocre pairing at this level and if Forshaw is out for our remaining games then we aren't getting another point.
 
Jul 12, 2016
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What the hell did he do wrong today?! You realise it was Galloway not closing down the second scorer? Whitaker's abysmal lack of effort? No, point the finger at Scarr because that's easy because he was a lower league player. So f-ing predictable
Agreed. Galloway did not play well today. Stoke here he comes!
 
Jul 12, 2016
8,454
5,811
MGM has nailed it, as usual.

To flame these players is to be blind to the gulf in resources with most clubs in this division.

Stoke are a massively underachieving squad who clicked today.

Ultimately, we were 2nd best but at 0-0 it looked at times like we might sneak ahead. Had that happened, it would have played out very differently, perhaps.

This game was always going to have a special type of focus. Glad it is done to be honest.

It’s in our own hands - very much so - with 2 games to go. I’m optimistic. 21st will be a great achievement if we make it.
So before a goal is kicked let's all resign ourselves to the fact that we are so financially poor we are wasting our time in the championship.
 
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Sep 6, 2006
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Really disappointed in the team today. I don't mind being beaten by superior quality in this league but today wasn't about that, Stoke just wanted it more.

That's the second time we've lost Forshaw to injury in an away game and then completely crumbled. Randell and Houghton are a mediocre pairing at this level and if Forshaw is out for our remaining games then we aren't getting another point.
Looked like a hamstring so that will be it. Needs to hang his boots up. I also don't see us getting another point.
 

MGM

✨Pasoti Donor✨
Dec 7, 2021
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Agree with elements of this post but you can't be seriously trying to say that the 2nd half performance is typical for the likes of Randell, Mumba and Houghton etc. They have all played much, much better in other games this season. Randell, Whittaker and Hardi were particularly below par today.q

We can compete with this quality of player but they need to all be on 7/10 at least, or we need tactical alternatives to change the game our way (Schuey smashed this last season). But we don't have those options in the squad right now.

Mr Hallett talks about 'outsmarting' other teams, the key to that is finding 'wee nuggets', finding a way to keep players fit and in decent form as well as having the players to transition tactically to a plan B, or maybe even a C when we are under the cosh.

None of that is unachievable in my eyes. Extremely difficult, yes absolutely. But if we give up on that ideology, that direction, that dream... then what's the point in being an Argyle fan?

OK, before today l would of said l would have a good argument for Randell being the type of player at this level who isn't your first choice midfielder, but can come off the bench (or when rotating within the squad) & would be fine within your championship squad. He isnt consistent enough to play week in, week out, at this level & be our best midfielder. And that is what he is, but only due to Forshaw being so injury prone & Houghton not being good enough. I didn't rate Houghton last year & would love to know what it is people think he does. He doesn't score goals or assist. He doesn't protect the defence. Have a look at Stoke's first goal today & watch the player burst clear of him before passing the ball.

Mumba, l honestly don't know he is. Unlike others l see a player there but can you remember too many games where Mumba shone in the wing back role in a real attacking sense. I just don't think he is this. So he hasn't proven himself at this level.

Stoke were dreadful. There was so much space to run at their back four. And look at how we used it after they scored. It was like them scoring just killed us. It was horrible to watch the lack of simply any ideas & the team shape just looked all over the place,

The fact is the chances are this is the best it gets as an Argyle fan. Fightening at the bottom of the championship. We get a good manager, the liklihood is we lose him. Have a decent player like Galloway, chances are he will move on a free. The point of being an Argyle fan is yes to keep dreaming but unless you embrace our financial situstion, then reality of what we saw today is put down to a bad day at the office. Calling players bottle jobs, when actually they just weren't good enough. Once again.

We need to survive. We need more money. We need much more to turn the dream anywhere near reality.
 
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Jul 6, 2005
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We could say a lot about why Stoke were so good today and we were so bad.

But today should also put to bed the nonsense that Dewsnip was the real brains behind last season's success and that a starry-eyed Schumacher looked up to him as some sort of guru.

Schumacher gave Dewsnip a lesson on how to be a proper Manager today. As much as anything, we lost today because Schumacher completely out-coached Dewsnip.

Our players make things easy for our opponents by constantly giving the ball away, making poor defensive mistakes and missing good chances.

But Dewsnip also made it easy for Schumacher today by being so predictable with his team selection and tactics.
 
Oct 20, 2022
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Tough watch today.We were very poor.How many of the team who started today would you want to start the first game next season ?That is still likely to be in the Championship so there is a lot to do.No lack of effort but the quality was way off.Not an easy job for the next manager!
 

MGM

✨Pasoti Donor✨
Dec 7, 2021
2,952
4,796
We could say a lot about why Stoke were so good today and we were so bad.

But today should also put to bed the nonsense that Dewsnip was the real brains behind last season's success and that a starry-eyed Schumacher looked up to him as some sort of guru.

Schumacher gave Dewsnip a lesson on how to be a proper Manager today. As much as anything, we lost today because Schumacher completely out-coached Dewsnip.

Our players make things easy for our opponents by constantly giving the ball away, making poor defensive mistakes and missing good chances.

But Dewsnip also made it easy for Schumacher today by being so predictable with his team selection and tactics.

This giving the ball away though happened alot last year. We just found a way to get a postive result.

I give you Bolton as a prime example. There is nothing you described above that wasn't in the EFL trophy game at Wembley. You would of said Evatt schooled Schumacher.

Today isn't just Dewdnip's fault in terms of his tactics today. Its a result of bad habits continuing & where as last season we could cover them up by Cooper's great form or individual brillant goals, this season it's much harder to achieve.

That midfield hasn't had a proper CDM for years. And once again, today we see a lost of the ball, in midfield, a team running at our defensive line with no challenge & a ball slid down the sides.

As for the goals, our lack of penetrative width means we try to play through this teams or look to Whittaker for some magic. He has dried up, there is no Azaz, and therefore the team looks much worse than earlier in season. People whack the ball up to Hardie like he some greyhound playing fetch. Then people wonder why he has no impact.
 
Last edited:
Sep 3, 2009
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977
So before a goal is kicked let's all resign ourselves to the fact that we are so financially poor we are wasting our time in the championship.
No, more that just staying up this season, even on goal difference, is punching above our weight.
Who knows what might happen next but survival this season will have meant we’ve maximised the cards in our hand.
 
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