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Brief Synopsis
- Thread starter PL2 3DQ
- Start date
If we assume nothing is wrong in the camp can you explain how professional footballers can turn in a performance like that?RL has been very fortunate to have been given the backing to put together a backroom staff that his predecessors could only dream about.The Halletts must be starting to worry what they have gotten themselves into. We will see how much a tailspin Ipswich are in on Saturday!WoodsyGreen":1tgnuzfo said:
While I agree it was an awful performance and one of the worst for several years. I am hopeful we using this as a mark in the sand to focus on greater defensive organisation and lose our brittleness where we concede some really soft goals. If not other teams will simply watch the Fleetwood and Rochdale videos and work out to beat us.
A few observations.
- Is Lowe's system dependent on Mayor? -Without Mayor we look very very ordinary. For Lowe is his success and system built around a ball carrying player like Mayor moving us up the pitch? If so this is very concerning for when he is injured or out.
- Lowe's first real test as manager - I feel this is the first real test of Lowe's managerial career. Up until now his introduction to management has generally been smooth sailing. Now the test. He has the help of Dewsnip and his coaching team. It will be interesting to see how he handles this. I hope calm heads, a few tweaks to adapt the system, plan B and C and work on the training ground will make this happen. This is where the manager really earns his money. Confidence will be low and teams will be coming to have a right go at us. Ipswich are a good side. We need a scrappy 0-0 to get our confidence back in our defence. We are better than 0-4 and 1-5 but maybe not as good as we thought we were. Time to show Lowe's grit qualities to go with his glitz.
- Reaction to players out of the team - Canavan and Wotton have both been out of the team and this was the game in theory the back 3 cement their places. However the casualness was alarming. On the first and second goals watch how slow to react the chasing back was from both these players. I would have thought that a spell out of the team would have made them more motivated to get in the team and stay in it. I felt that was the most disappointing thing about tonight, the reaction to players being left out. Both played themselves out of the team tonight. And I think if we are to progress in league one, we will need a step up in defender quality. They seem like good blokes and I know they care about the club but they need to hold their hands up and take a hard look at themselves tonight.
- Bite in Midfield and Camara - Lowe took him off after 10 mins at Fleetwood, too harsh I felt. Also he only brought him on when 4-0 down. In his Cameo he got 3 shots away, a lot of his own making and adds presence to Midfield. He needs to be in the team gaining experience, as I think he genuinely gives us something in Midfield. Why Lowe is reluctant to play him more I don't know? Reeves, Grant or Mayor need someone like Camara alongside them. He is the future and he is our player lets get him in the team
- Keeper situation - I think everyone is being harsh if blaming Cooper. He has been playing well, was very good against Lincoln. He was not at fault for any of the goals today. He had experienced defenders that went missing today. We should not get on his back. The defenders were awful.
- Strikers and chance conversion - Lacking cutting edge, pace and aggressiveness tonight. They were poor. Interestingly looking at the BBC stats on shots and chances. Hardie/Telford/ Nouble have had 57 shots this season between them and scored 4 goals. Jephcott has had 18 and scored 8 goals. We had 19 shots today and 2 on target. Then add to that Mayor and Camara have had 34 shots and scored 2 goals this season. Today if we had of got back to 1-1 we probably could have settled down and gone on to win bizarrely. So the strikers did not do their job tonight. We need to get on that training pitch and get some shooting practice. Also I think we need to score more goals from quick transition and day I say it long balls into the channels (dare, I say it, a bit of "Adamsball" occasionally perhaps ? !). I think sometimes if we are too slow in building our attack the opposition get 8-10 people in the box making it hard to get a shot that is not blocked. https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/team ... op-scorers
- Fans back - can we back the team please even if they are poor again - While we are all angry now, for whoever is going Saturday, the team are going to need every bit of support to get their confidence up, I can imagine with confidence down and lets say we go 1-0 down the crowd could turn negative. Please let's support them as much as possible these next few games they will need it while they get they take time to get their mojo back. If we can set our expectations to support the team thinking we are in a dogfight this season then perhaps that passion will transmit to the players to scrap for every ball and every point, which is the back to basics approach right now to get us out of this bad run.
Bloody hell Argyle! - I got up at 6.45am and got to work late today to watch you...it's never easy supporting you! Bring on the Tractor boys and please get our hope back again please!
:scarf:
A few observations.
- Is Lowe's system dependent on Mayor? -Without Mayor we look very very ordinary. For Lowe is his success and system built around a ball carrying player like Mayor moving us up the pitch? If so this is very concerning for when he is injured or out.
- Lowe's first real test as manager - I feel this is the first real test of Lowe's managerial career. Up until now his introduction to management has generally been smooth sailing. Now the test. He has the help of Dewsnip and his coaching team. It will be interesting to see how he handles this. I hope calm heads, a few tweaks to adapt the system, plan B and C and work on the training ground will make this happen. This is where the manager really earns his money. Confidence will be low and teams will be coming to have a right go at us. Ipswich are a good side. We need a scrappy 0-0 to get our confidence back in our defence. We are better than 0-4 and 1-5 but maybe not as good as we thought we were. Time to show Lowe's grit qualities to go with his glitz.
- Reaction to players out of the team - Canavan and Wotton have both been out of the team and this was the game in theory the back 3 cement their places. However the casualness was alarming. On the first and second goals watch how slow to react the chasing back was from both these players. I would have thought that a spell out of the team would have made them more motivated to get in the team and stay in it. I felt that was the most disappointing thing about tonight, the reaction to players being left out. Both played themselves out of the team tonight. And I think if we are to progress in league one, we will need a step up in defender quality. They seem like good blokes and I know they care about the club but they need to hold their hands up and take a hard look at themselves tonight.
- Bite in Midfield and Camara - Lowe took him off after 10 mins at Fleetwood, too harsh I felt. Also he only brought him on when 4-0 down. In his Cameo he got 3 shots away, a lot of his own making and adds presence to Midfield. He needs to be in the team gaining experience, as I think he genuinely gives us something in Midfield. Why Lowe is reluctant to play him more I don't know? Reeves, Grant or Mayor need someone like Camara alongside them. He is the future and he is our player lets get him in the team
- Keeper situation - I think everyone is being harsh if blaming Cooper. He has been playing well, was very good against Lincoln. He was not at fault for any of the goals today. He had experienced defenders that went missing today. We should not get on his back. The defenders were awful.
- Strikers and chance conversion - Lacking cutting edge, pace and aggressiveness tonight. They were poor. Interestingly looking at the BBC stats on shots and chances. Hardie/Telford/ Nouble have had 57 shots this season between them and scored 4 goals. Jephcott has had 18 and scored 8 goals. We had 19 shots today and 2 on target. Then add to that Mayor and Camara have had 34 shots and scored 2 goals this season. Today if we had of got back to 1-1 we probably could have settled down and gone on to win bizarrely. So the strikers did not do their job tonight. We need to get on that training pitch and get some shooting practice. Also I think we need to score more goals from quick transition and day I say it long balls into the channels (dare, I say it, a bit of "Adamsball" occasionally perhaps ? !). I think sometimes if we are too slow in building our attack the opposition get 8-10 people in the box making it hard to get a shot that is not blocked. https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/team ... op-scorers
- Fans back - can we back the team please even if they are poor again - While we are all angry now, for whoever is going Saturday, the team are going to need every bit of support to get their confidence up, I can imagine with confidence down and lets say we go 1-0 down the crowd could turn negative. Please let's support them as much as possible these next few games they will need it while they get they take time to get their mojo back. If we can set our expectations to support the team thinking we are in a dogfight this season then perhaps that passion will transmit to the players to scrap for every ball and every point, which is the back to basics approach right now to get us out of this bad run.
Bloody hell Argyle! - I got up at 6.45am and got to work late today to watch you...it's never easy supporting you! Bring on the Tractor boys and please get our hope back again please!
:scarf:
14 league games in and 1/3rd of the season almost done, I have to say I don't think summer recruitment has been particularly good. Our best or most consistent player(s) have been in my view, Watts & Fornah. I wouldn't give even a 7 to either of those two however, but instead 6 - 6.5. Others like Opoku, Reeves, McCormick, Camara, MacLeod, Abraham, Ruddy, and whoever else, haven't really had enough game time week in week out, to be fairly judged. I'm not including Cooper or Hardie for obvious reasons but even those two 'signings' have yet to hit the ground running. I feel like we are a little bit spoiled and have too many players on the books, too many options.
As per what a couple of others have said in other threads, there has been far too much chopping and changing of team selection. There is also a lack of leadership down the spin and across our back line. At the moment, you could head to your local casino this weekend and have the names of our six centrebacks on a roulette wheel and spin the ball three times to pick our back three. I only rate Aimson out of the lot and even he has been off this season. Midfield is far too one dimensional, full of tippy tappy happy players.
You look at last season in League 2 and we brought in the likes of Cooper, Hardie, Palmer, Grant, Bakinson etc, all of whom pushed us on. Fornah, Watts. Opoku, Abraham etc, it's not quite the same as far as I can see. Need a good January.
As per what a couple of others have said in other threads, there has been far too much chopping and changing of team selection. There is also a lack of leadership down the spin and across our back line. At the moment, you could head to your local casino this weekend and have the names of our six centrebacks on a roulette wheel and spin the ball three times to pick our back three. I only rate Aimson out of the lot and even he has been off this season. Midfield is far too one dimensional, full of tippy tappy happy players.
You look at last season in League 2 and we brought in the likes of Cooper, Hardie, Palmer, Grant, Bakinson etc, all of whom pushed us on. Fornah, Watts. Opoku, Abraham etc, it's not quite the same as far as I can see. Need a good January.
Be interesting to see if Mayor is part of the squad on Saturday. It shouldn't take him long to get over a dickie tummy. Although I wouldn't be surprised if he was still 'ill'. Imo there is definitely something not right in the group. We are seeing similar performances to when Adam's was here and had the falling out with players. There is no desire or fight from too many players in this team. They are just going through the motions. Professional and motivated players will work hard for the whole game especially if they are behind but only a few have done that for the past few games. Lowe keeps telling us that we have a team that can compete in this league so why all of a sudden are we no longer doing that.
Balham_Green":1b0wp1cn said:
Judging the quality of an opposition forward by how many problems he causes our defence seems like a risky thing to do in my opinion...
skynet":8fev5671 said:
Indeed and that’s why some perspective is required. We are not perfect. However, that was a horrible performance and so soon after Fleetwood is very concerning. We know our away form is pathetic, so losing what should be a comfortable home fixture now means we need to dig in and either beat Ipswich on Saturday or get some points on the road somewhere. Both would be nice but I’m not getting my hopes up.
January needs to come around quickly and that back line needs strengthening at all three positions. We’ve seen enough evidence now of who has been capable of making the step up to League One and unfortunately, a number of them have shown they are not up to it.
A LWB, RCB, CB and Striker are a must. A RWB would be nice too, but not the priority. Edwards is performing well, and was the only player who looked like he gave a poo in the first half last night. Wootton and Canavan should be moved on.
Until then Aimson - Opoku - Watts needs to be the combination. It isn’t perfect, but it served us well enough in our good run until the disaster at Fleetwood.
Our good start maybe got people’s expectations up a little too much. We now need to steady the ship ASAP and grind out a couple much needed wins, and hopefully a clean sheet somewhere.
Rant time.
How did Ryan Lowe watch that first half, watch Rochdale pull the same trick on us over and over again, and not do anything to counter it?
4, 5 maybe 6 times in the first 45 (or 64!), Rochdale's 4-4-2 cut us open on the counter. We'd have possession on the right hand side, and (as Lowe likes), the opposite wing back needs to get into the box for a deep cross or pass. However, our cross is aimless, and the Rochdale right winger hares off downfield. Obviously our left wing back is too far forward, so Watts has to come across and cover. Then the right striker hits the channel, dragging Canavan across. Leaving a lovely big gaping hole in our defence (which you'd want Fornah to fill, but the less said about his defensive covering ability, the better, which is a shame because he played some good passes tonight). This happened time and time again. All we had to do to counter it was to drop our left wing back back 10 yards. Did Lowe do anything? No.
Credit to Rochdale - whilst their back line looked shaky defensively, going forward they were excellent. Knew exactly how to play us. Out of possession as well, their forwards and midfielders did what Fleetwood did to us - not pressing our back 3 and cutting off the midfield supply. Forcing us to go long. When we do that, we're rubbish.
When this happens, our back 3 need to be better passers of the ball. Wootton can't pass. Neither can Aimson. Watts is normally ok in this regard but he wasn't last night. However, what I will in say in their defence is - how bloody static were our forward players off the ball?! When we went 3 up front, they were terrible! Just standing there waiting. It was like watching a Sheridan performance - absolutely no cohesion, movement or desire.
Individually, despite the issues highlighted above tactically, the defenders were a mess. All 5 of them who played last night were on a scale between below par and absolutely calamitous. The 3rd goal is a pi$$take. The main blame is with Wootton (why on EARTH did he leave it?!) but also, Canavan and Edwards shamefully got nowhere near their men and let them head it wherever they wanted. Edwards at right back in a back 4? No thank you.
As I said in the other thread, we MUST play 2 DM's. One centre back pushes forward to overlap and support the attack, whichever DM is closest slots into the back 3 as cover. It would just balance us so much more.
We actually created a few chances last night - the best of which Jephcott fluffed. But when our defensive players are that bad, even if we'd taken all of our good chances, we'd probably still only be looking at a draw.
I'm starting to worry about Hardie's form, too. I'd start him on Saturday but also be telling him - if your form doesn't pick up soon, then it's goodbye.
BIG reaction needed on Saturday.
Cooper 5
Wootton 3
Canavan 3
Watts 4
Fornah 5
Edwards 5
Reeves 4
Grant 5 MOTM (did well at left wing back, again)
G Cooper 4
Jephcott 4
Nouble 4
Subs: Moore 5, Hardie 3, Aimson 5, Opoku 4, Camara 5.
How did Ryan Lowe watch that first half, watch Rochdale pull the same trick on us over and over again, and not do anything to counter it?
4, 5 maybe 6 times in the first 45 (or 64!), Rochdale's 4-4-2 cut us open on the counter. We'd have possession on the right hand side, and (as Lowe likes), the opposite wing back needs to get into the box for a deep cross or pass. However, our cross is aimless, and the Rochdale right winger hares off downfield. Obviously our left wing back is too far forward, so Watts has to come across and cover. Then the right striker hits the channel, dragging Canavan across. Leaving a lovely big gaping hole in our defence (which you'd want Fornah to fill, but the less said about his defensive covering ability, the better, which is a shame because he played some good passes tonight). This happened time and time again. All we had to do to counter it was to drop our left wing back back 10 yards. Did Lowe do anything? No.
Credit to Rochdale - whilst their back line looked shaky defensively, going forward they were excellent. Knew exactly how to play us. Out of possession as well, their forwards and midfielders did what Fleetwood did to us - not pressing our back 3 and cutting off the midfield supply. Forcing us to go long. When we do that, we're rubbish.
When this happens, our back 3 need to be better passers of the ball. Wootton can't pass. Neither can Aimson. Watts is normally ok in this regard but he wasn't last night. However, what I will in say in their defence is - how bloody static were our forward players off the ball?! When we went 3 up front, they were terrible! Just standing there waiting. It was like watching a Sheridan performance - absolutely no cohesion, movement or desire.
Individually, despite the issues highlighted above tactically, the defenders were a mess. All 5 of them who played last night were on a scale between below par and absolutely calamitous. The 3rd goal is a pi$$take. The main blame is with Wootton (why on EARTH did he leave it?!) but also, Canavan and Edwards shamefully got nowhere near their men and let them head it wherever they wanted. Edwards at right back in a back 4? No thank you.
As I said in the other thread, we MUST play 2 DM's. One centre back pushes forward to overlap and support the attack, whichever DM is closest slots into the back 3 as cover. It would just balance us so much more.
We actually created a few chances last night - the best of which Jephcott fluffed. But when our defensive players are that bad, even if we'd taken all of our good chances, we'd probably still only be looking at a draw.
I'm starting to worry about Hardie's form, too. I'd start him on Saturday but also be telling him - if your form doesn't pick up soon, then it's goodbye.
BIG reaction needed on Saturday.
Cooper 5
Wootton 3
Canavan 3
Watts 4
Fornah 5
Edwards 5
Reeves 4
Grant 5 MOTM (did well at left wing back, again)
G Cooper 4
Jephcott 4
Nouble 4
Subs: Moore 5, Hardie 3, Aimson 5, Opoku 4, Camara 5.
oldage":3necrfzv said:
Cut Abraham’s loan short and we have two loan slots available, firstly.
After that, some of the fringe players / underperformers being loaned out is not unrealistic. Whilst Wootton and Canavan are not League 1 standard, they are competent League 2 defenders. Finding them a club should not be too difficult. I would imagine both of them are on semi-decent wages too as experienced pro’s.
Beyond that, it all depends on what the squad’s budget looks like. However I’m sure Simon Hallett will be ensuring it is appropriate for our situation and will not take any financial risks in the current climate.