Canavan joins Bradford

[Antipodean]

To be blunt, that sort of disgusting comment about a player who has given good service to the club, even if some of us feel not good enough for this level, is the sort of comment that the moderators should be dealing with. As has been said, totally unacceptable and just uncalled for. Don’t think anybody has called into question Canavan's commitment. If any of us had called Carlo the same derogatory term, or even idiot, we would have been openly censured

Final warning now!

Don’t push buttons as you won’t like the inevitable outcome.

The comment from Carlos is beneath contempt in my opinion but that’s all it is. Not one Mod has thought for to remove it, and I applaud that decision.

So, you have now had your FINAL warning, carry on with your ‘game’ and I’ll personally hit the ban button.

Choice is yours.

Hmmmmm.

I don't agree with Carlo whatsoever. However, this is a forum for football opinions. If you choose to ban people because you don't agree with their opinions then it undermines the openness of PASOTI. Almost as if you can't post here unless you hold a certain viewpoint.

You clearly don't understand the difference between holding an opinion and the way in which it is expressed. Anyone on this site is perfectly welcome to say that they have never rated a player, are glad that they have moved on, etc. They can do that perfectly freely without using vile language. It is a lesson that functioning adults and most children have learnt.

 

[Devongreenowl]

To be blunt, that sort of disgusting comment about a player who has given good service to the club, even if some of us feel not good enough for this level, is the sort of comment that the moderators should be dealing with. As has been said, totally unacceptable and just uncalled for. Don’t think anybody has called into question Canavan's commitment. If any of us had called Carlo the same derogatory term, or even idiot, we would have been openly censured

Final warning now!

Don’t push buttons as you won’t like the inevitable outcome.

The comment from Carlos is beneath contempt in my opinion but that’s all it is. Not one Mod has thought for to remove it, and I applaud that decision.

So, you have now had your FINAL warning, carry on with your ‘game’ and I’ll personally hit the ban button.

Choice is yours.

Hmmmmm.

I don't agree with Carlo whatsoever. However, this is a forum for football opinions. If you choose to ban people because you don't agree with their opinions then it undermines the openness of PASOTI. Almost as if you can't post here unless you hold a certain viewpoint.

You clearly don't understand the difference between holding an opinion and the way in which it is expressed. Anyone on this site is perfectly welcome to say that they have never rated a player, are glad that they have moved on, etc. They can do that perfectly freely without using vile language. It is a lesson that functioning adults and most children have learnt.

Sound point, though to be fair it’s not totally clear who/what Gaspar is referring to in the main body of his comment. Maybe he wanted it that way as he hasn’t responded to Greenthings query. Perhaps he feels unable to, who knows?

 

[up the line]

The Rochdale debacle was the final straw for Canavan for me. Specifically the goal where he assumed a goal kick would be given so stopped playing, then lethargically plodded back into the six yard box and watched the goal bound shot go by his head with zero effort to move a neck muscle to try and get something on it. It wasn't poor play as much as a unacceptable lack of professionalism and effort in not playing the whistle and then not busting a gut to get back into a goal saving position.
So I have to disagree with DGO in that I perceived a noticeable decline in Canavan's effort. Maybe he was annoyed at being in and out of the team or maybe he was already thinking of a move.
That said (excluding Opoku's 1 yarder against Pompey) he was the only cb at the club who looked like he might grab a few useful goals from set pieces.

 

[Devongreenowl]

The Rochdale debacle was the final straw for Canavan for me. Specifically the goal where he assumed a goal kick would be given so stopped playing, then lethargically plodded back into the six yard box and watched the goal bound shot go by his head with zero effort to move a neck muscle to try and get something on it. It wasn't poor play as much as a unacceptable lack of professionalism and effort in not playing the whistle and then not busting a gut to get back into a goal saving position.
So I have to disagree with DGO in that I perceived a noticeable decline in Canavan's effort. Maybe he was annoyed at being in and out of the team or maybe he was already thinking of a move.
That said (excluding Opoku's 1 yarder against Pompey) he was the only cb at the club who looked like he might grab a few useful goals from set pieces.

I’ve never said he was a great defender UTL. I said last summer that he, Wootton and Sawyer weren’t good enough for L1. I still however consider that he’s 'done his bit’ for Argyle and perhaps deserved to be referred to other than as one of the more unpleasant bodily functions. Sounds like the Bradford fans are pleased with the signing and they love it that he’s a local lad. Good luck to him.

 

[up the line]

The Rochdale debacle was the final straw for Canavan for me. Specifically the goal where he assumed a goal kick would be given so stopped playing, then lethargically plodded back into the six yard box and watched the goal bound shot go by his head with zero effort to move a neck muscle to try and get something on it. It wasn't poor play as much as a unacceptable lack of professionalism and effort in not playing the whistle and then not busting a gut to get back into a goal saving position.
So I have to disagree with DGO in that I perceived a noticeable decline in Canavan's effort. Maybe he was annoyed at being in and out of the team or maybe he was already thinking of a move.
That said (excluding Opoku's 1 yarder against Pompey) he was the only cb at the club who looked like he might grab a few useful goals from set pieces.

I’ve never said he was a great defender UTL. I said last summer that he, Wootton and Sawyer weren’t good enough for L1. I still however consider that he’s 'done his bit’ for Argyle and perhaps deserved to be referred to other than as one of the more unpleasant bodily functions. Sounds like the Bradford fans are pleased with the signing and they love it that he’s a local lad. Good luck to him.

I was disagreeing with you on his commitment.
You said no-one had questioned his commitment.
I do question his commitment in the last few weeks and months as illustrated by the Rochdale goal, which I commented on on the day

 

[Knibbsworth]

The Rochdale debacle was the final straw for Canavan for me. Specifically the goal where he assumed a goal kick would be given so stopped playing, then lethargically plodded back into the six yard box and watched the goal bound shot go by his head with zero effort to move a neck muscle to try and get something on it. It wasn't poor play as much as a unacceptable lack of professionalism and effort in not playing the whistle and then not busting a gut to get back into a goal saving position.
So I have to disagree with DGO in that I perceived a noticeable decline in Canavan's effort. Maybe he was annoyed at being in and out of the team or maybe he was already thinking of a move.
That said (excluding Opoku's 1 yarder against Pompey) he was the only cb at the club who looked like he might grab a few useful goals from set pieces.

It seems fashionable to slate Canavan for that goal now. People forget that the ball looked out on the cameras, to the pundits and all the defenders involved.

If Canavan plays on, sprints back, it gives the impression he thought it was still in - which it wasn't.

 

[up the line]

The Rochdale debacle was the final straw for Canavan for me. Specifically the goal where he assumed a goal kick would be given so stopped playing, then lethargically plodded back into the six yard box and watched the goal bound shot go by his head with zero effort to move a neck muscle to try and get something on it. It wasn't poor play as much as a unacceptable lack of professionalism and effort in not playing the whistle and then not busting a gut to get back into a goal saving position.
So I have to disagree with DGO in that I perceived a noticeable decline in Canavan's effort. Maybe he was annoyed at being in and out of the team or maybe he was already thinking of a move.
That said (excluding Opoku's 1 yarder against Pompey) he was the only cb at the club who looked like he might grab a few useful goals from set pieces.

It seems fashionable to slate Canavan for that goal now. People forget that the ball looked out on the cameras, to the pundits and all the defenders involved.

If Canavan plays on, sprints back, it gives the impression he thought it was still in - which it wasn't.

I commented on it on the day. Nothing to do with being fashionable ta.

Seems to me you're suggesting that if players think a decision should be made in their favour they should just stop in order to convince the ref.
Personally I was always told to play to the whistle and I wouldn't have accepted that attitude from an under 8s team

 

[Knibbsworth]

The Rochdale debacle was the final straw for Canavan for me. Specifically the goal where he assumed a goal kick would be given so stopped playing, then lethargically plodded back into the six yard box and watched the goal bound shot go by his head with zero effort to move a neck muscle to try and get something on it. It wasn't poor play as much as a unacceptable lack of professionalism and effort in not playing the whistle and then not busting a gut to get back into a goal saving position.
So I have to disagree with DGO in that I perceived a noticeable decline in Canavan's effort. Maybe he was annoyed at being in and out of the team or maybe he was already thinking of a move.
That said (excluding Opoku's 1 yarder against Pompey) he was the only cb at the club who looked like he might grab a few useful goals from set pieces.

It seems fashionable to slate Canavan for that goal now. People forget that the ball looked out on the cameras, to the pundits and all the defenders involved.

If Canavan plays on, sprints back, it gives the impression he thought it was still in - which it wasn't.

I commented on it on the day. Nothing to do with being fashionable ta.

Seems to me you're suggesting that if players think a decision should be made in their favour they should just stop in order to convince the ref.
Personally I was always told to play to the whistle and I wouldn't have accepted that attitude from an under 8s team

"Play to the whistle."

You do realise the referee doesn't blow the whistle every time the ball goes out of the pitch?

If Canavan plays on with all the enthusiasm of your under 8s, the referee will assume the ball never went out and play on.
Canavan had the best view and thought it was out. It looked out from the cameras. Rather than slag our player off for "lacking commitment" I'm more inclined to believe it was a refereeing error.

 

[Devongreenowl]

You’re absolutely right Re play to the whistle UTL and the defending that day was an absolute joke from all involved not just Canavan. Was just wondering what your evidence was for questioning his commitment over a period of 'weeks and months' though?

 

[up the line]

You’re absolutely right Re play to the whistle UTL and the defending that day was an absolute joke from all involved not just Canavan. Was just wondering what your evidence was for questioning his commitment over a period of 'weeks and months' though?

A general drop in effort levels is hard to qualify with specific examples as I'm sure you know.
However to pick two the Rochdale goal illustrated a lack of effort or care perfectly. I also felt that his sending off at Fleetwood after being brought on as a sub was very stupid and possibly derived from his annoyance at being out of the team at that point.
Other than that you're asking me to do the impossible as I don't have access to his garmin tracker so I can't provide actual data to support my personal opinion that I saw less effort

 

[Devongreenowl]

You’re absolutely right Re play to the whistle UTL and the defending that day was an absolute joke from all involved not just Canavan. Was just wondering what your evidence was for questioning his commitment over a period of 'weeks and months' though?

A general drop in effort levels is hard to qualify with specific examples as I'm sure you know.
However to pick two the Rochdale goal illustrated a lack of effort or care perfectly. I also felt that his sending off at Fleetwood after being brought on as a sub was very stupid and possibly derived from his annoyance at being out of the team at that point.
Other than that you're asking me to do the impossible as I don't have access to his garmin tracker so I can't provide actual data to support my personal opinion that I saw less effort

Fair enough UTL. I do think it would be hard to gain the impression over a period of months that a player wasn’t putting a shift in, based on the limited coverage of iPlayer and maybe a handful of games if your were lucky enough to get in. I never like to accuse a player of shirking personally, but happy to call it when they just aren’t good enough at a particular level. Canavan has proved it twice now that he isn’t a L1 player. Wootton continues to prove it even moreso whenever Lowe gives him the opportunity. I’m sure one thing we agree on is that the defence just isn’t good enough.

 

[up the line]

You’re absolutely right Re play to the whistle UTL and the defending that day was an absolute joke from all involved not just Canavan. Was just wondering what your evidence was for questioning his commitment over a period of 'weeks and months' though?

A general drop in effort levels is hard to qualify with specific examples as I'm sure you know.
However to pick two the Rochdale goal illustrated a lack of effort or care perfectly. I also felt that his sending off at Fleetwood after being brought on as a sub was very stupid and possibly derived from his annoyance at being out of the team at that point.
Other than that you're asking me to do the impossible as I don't have access to his garmin tracker so I can't provide actual data to support my personal opinion that I saw less effort

Fair enough UTL. I do think it would be hard to gain the impression over a period of months that a player wasn’t putting a shift in, based on the limited coverage of iPlayer and maybe a handful of games if your were lucky enough to get in. I never like to accuse a player of shirking personally, but happy to call it when they just aren’t good enough at a particular level. Canavan has proved it twice now that he isn’t a L1 player. Wootton continues to prove it even moreso whenever Lowe gives him the opportunity. I’m sure one thing we agree on is that the defence just isn’t good enough.

Absolutely. And I see Canavan moving on as an opportunity to bring in someone who improves us.
I think both are fairly standard L2 defenders because at that level they can get away with one, maybe two mistakes per game. Against the upper half of L1 you don't get that leeway.

 

[Devongreenowl]

You’re absolutely right Re play to the whistle UTL and the defending that day was an absolute joke from all involved not just Canavan. Was just wondering what your evidence was for questioning his commitment over a period of 'weeks and months' though?

A general drop in effort levels is hard to qualify with specific examples as I'm sure you know.
However to pick two the Rochdale goal illustrated a lack of effort or care perfectly. I also felt that his sending off at Fleetwood after being brought on as a sub was very stupid and possibly derived from his annoyance at being out of the team at that point.
Other than that you're asking me to do the impossible as I don't have access to his garmin tracker so I can't provide actual data to support my personal opinion that I saw less effort

Fair enough UTL. I do think it would be hard to gain the impression over a period of months that a player wasn’t putting a shift in, based on the limited coverage of iPlayer and maybe a handful of games if your were lucky enough to get in. I never like to accuse a player of shirking personally, but happy to call it when they just aren’t good enough at a particular level. Canavan has proved it twice now that he isn’t a L1 player. Wootton continues to prove it even moreso whenever Lowe gives him the opportunity. I’m sure one thing we agree on is that the defence just isn’t good enough.

Absolutely. And I see Canavan moving on as an opportunity to bring in someone who improves us.
I think both are fairly standard L2 defenders because at that level they can get away with one, maybe two mistakes per game. Against the upper half of L1 you don't get that leeway.

:thumbs: