Overthinking of defeats

[landons forehead]

I wouldn't call scratching around for one of three automatic promotion spots in the basement division as "doing incredibly well", but that's just me.

 

[oldage]

Really, really good football teams get beaten. And beaten heavily.

We were the form team in the entire country aside from Liverpool before today, and we’re still doing incredibly well, but there are many drawing conclusions and wanting change based on one game.

You know you have real problems when there’s a pattern of bad form, but rushing to conclusions after one bad day at the office is totally counter-productive and reactionary. This is where Lowe and Argyle hold their nerve, stick to their guns and keep doing the things that have made us increasingly look like the best side in the division.

We went on a ridiculous run of form after the Exeter debacle, if this defeat focuses minds and produces another remotely similar run of form, then we will be going up automatically :thumbup:

Increasing looking like the best side in the division.
:funny:

Well the league table shows us 6 points off the top with two in hand and the form table had us the best team in the country bar Liverpool, so I’d be curious to know how that’s such a ridiculous statement :thumbup:

Ok ,I'll be blunt! How we are where we are in the table is beyond me. I cannot recall the last time we played like "the best in the division" Time will tell but if we are the best ,god help the worst!

 

[demportdave]

To get back to the original thread, it’s not a question of over-thinking defeats, it’s more a case of frustration with Lowe thinking that we can set up the same every game regardless of the opposition and we paid the price for that yesterday. Not only were Colchester able to nullify our style of play, they completely imposed their style on us and really should have won 5 or 6-nil on the day.

To dismiss yesterday as simply “a bad day at the office” is simplistic and short-sighted. We have got away with it against lesser teams where the defensive and tactical shortcomings have been overlooked or ignored, Mansfield is an obvious example.

It’s an old cliche, but it is often the case that the Manager learns more from a defeat than he does from a win. But Lowe just trots out his line about playing in a certain way and that he is not going to change. However, I will be very surprised if he doesn’t make 2 or 3 changes to the starting line-up on Tuesday evening.

It’s not about changing your basic footballing philosophy, it’s realising that occasionally - over the course of a very long season - you have to modify the way you set your team up, particularly in very tough away games like yesterday.

I like Lowe, he has been a breath of fresh air and has undoubtedly got the ability to get us out of this awful Division and maybe even further up the Football League. But he needs to introduce a degree of pragmatism into his thinking.

 

[oldage]

To get back to the original thread, it’s not a question of over-thinking defeats, it’s more a case of frustration with Lowe thinking that we can set up the same every game regardless of the opposition and we paid the price for that yesterday. Not only were Colchester able to nullify our style of play, they completely imposed their style on us and really should have won 5 or 6-nil on the day.

To dismiss yesterday as simply “a bad day at the office” is simplistic and short-sighted. We have got away with it against lesser teams where the defensive and tactical shortcomings have been overlooked or ignored, Mansfield is an obvious example.

It’s an old cliche, but it is often the case that the Manager learns more from a defeat than he does from a win. But Lowe just trots out his line about playing in a certain way and that he is not going to change. However, I will be very surprised if he doesn’t make 2 or 3 changes to the starting line-up on Tuesday evening.

It’s not about changing your basic footballing philosophy, it’s realising that occasionally - over the course of a very long season - you have to modify the way you set your team up, particularly in very tough away games like yesterday.

I like Lowe, he has been a breath of fresh air and has undoubtedly got the ability to get us out of this awful Division and maybe even further up the Football League. But he needs to introduce a degree of pragmatism into his thinking.

:thumbup:

 

[Devongreenowl]

The thing that worries me is the lack of fight and effort. The style of football is better, there is still a time and a place for “blood and snotters” to coin a luggyism

Do you mean like when Sawyer took that Mansfield winger out to earn himself a red card?
I think I’m going to have to consider not coming on here on the odd occasion when Argyle lose. It’s so frustrating to read the immediate negativity, when we are actually doing better than we should realistically have expected to. Most people thought it would take 3 or 4 windows to sort out the mess left by Adams, but here we are with two games in hand on Swindon, which if won would put us top.

Our 'friends' up the road have just gone three games without a win up until yesterday. I wonder if their fans get their knickers in a twist like some of ours after one defeat in seven games.

 

[Devongreenowl]

Really, really good football teams get beaten. And beaten heavily.

We were the form team in the entire country aside from Liverpool before today, and we’re still doing incredibly well, but there are many drawing conclusions and wanting change based on one game.

You know you have real problems when there’s a pattern of bad form, but rushing to conclusions after one bad day at the office is totally counter-productive and reactionary. This is where Lowe and Argyle hold their nerve, stick to their guns and keep doing the things that have made us increasingly look like the best side in the division.

We went on a ridiculous run of form after the Exeter debacle, if this defeat focuses minds and produces another remotely similar run of form, then we will be going up automatically :thumbup:

Increasing looking like the best side in the division.
:funny:

Well the league table shows us 6 points off the top with two in hand and the form table had us the best team in the country bar Liverpool, so I’d be curious to know how that’s such a ridiculous statement :thumbup:

Ok ,I'll be blunt! How we are where we are in the table is beyond me. I cannot recall the last time we played like "the best in the division" Time will tell but if we are the best ,god help the worst!

Usual negative tripe from you there Oldage.

 

[oldage]

Really, really good football teams get beaten. And beaten heavily.

We were the form team in the entire country aside from Liverpool before today, and we’re still doing incredibly well, but there are many drawing conclusions and wanting change based on one game.

You know you have real problems when there’s a pattern of bad form, but rushing to conclusions after one bad day at the office is totally counter-productive and reactionary. This is where Lowe and Argyle hold their nerve, stick to their guns and keep doing the things that have made us increasingly look like the best side in the division.

We went on a ridiculous run of form after the Exeter debacle, if this defeat focuses minds and produces another remotely similar run of form, then we will be going up automatically :thumbup:

Increasing looking like the best side in the division.
:funny:

Well the league table shows us 6 points off the top with two in hand and the form table had us the best team in the country bar Liverpool, so I’d be curious to know how that’s such a ridiculous statement :thumbup:

Ok ,I'll be blunt! How we are where we are in the table is beyond me. I cannot recall the last time we played like "the best in the division" Time will tell but if we are the best ,god help the worst!

Usual negative tripe from you there Oldage.

Don't start me off! At least I have only ever supported one club, ARGYLE! You dish out positive garbage on a regular basis.
Anybody who has witnessed our recent performances must be in cloud cuckoo land if they believe we have played well. We have rode our luck and ended up in a false position.
Why is it that when somebody points out the true situation some fans accuse them of being negative? Better to be realistic than deluded!

 

[Devongreenowl]

What difference does it make that I’m an Owl Oldage? I’m still a full season ticket holder at Argyle and have been to three away games this season, with another at Bradford coming up, despite Wednesday being at home that day. If you’re as miserable a 'supporter' at HP as you are on here, I know exactly what 'support' you’ll be giving on match days. Another of the 'hit it long' brigade no doubt. I’d rather be on the bright side of the street rather than the dark side like you and some others Oldage.

WAAAW WAWAW

 

[Green 1886]

The thing that worries me is the lack of fight and effort. The style of football is better, there is still a time and a place for “blood and snotters” to coin a luggyism

Do you mean like when Sawyer took that Mansfield winger out to earn himself a red card?
I think I’m going to have to consider not coming on here on the odd occasion when Argyle lose. It’s so frustrating to read the immediate negativity, when we are actually doing better than we should realistically have expected to. Most people thought it would take 3 or 4 windows to sort out the mess left by Adams, but here we are with two games in hand on Swindon, which if won would put us top.

Our 'friends' up the road have just gone three games without a win up until yesterday. I wonder if their fans get their knickers in a twist like some of ours after one defeat in seven games.

No I don't mean like that.

Don't think I'm being "immediately negative" - did you watch the game? There was no fight, no passion in that second half. Players were just standing off, like I say, even the Colchester comms could not be believe how poor we were 2nd half, they fully expected us to come out and put up a fight, we just rolled over.

 

[ming the merciless]

Mansfield is a great example. Lowe said they probably have the best front three in the league. Fortunately they were miss firing when we played them. But you could see the quality. So if we had set up with a pragmatic approach. Which is football speak for setting up with a more defensive approach to contain the opposition. Would we have won that game? I'm not convinced we would. It's very possible we could have sat in out own halve and ventured forward in limited numbers. Nothing wrong in that but we won that game by prioritising attack over defense. We risked conceding by playing brave football and were rewarded by notching up three valuable points. It has served us pretty well and it's exciting to watch. If you need binary football where more emphasis is on the defensive side of the game ( what we have done for as long as I can remember) maybe a strategic game like chess would be more up your street. :greensmile: I love what we are doing. Hate the losses but come on, every team in the country looses. Well except one.

 

[oldage]

What difference does it make that I’m an Owl Oldage? I’m still a full season ticket holder at Argyle and have been to three away games this season, with another at Bradford coming up, despite Wednesday being at home that day. If you’re as miserable a 'supporter' at HP as you are on here, I know exactly what 'support' you’ll be giving on match days. Another of the 'hit it long' brigade no doubt. I’d rather be on the bright side of the street rather than the dark side like you and some others Oldage.

WAAAW WAWAW

I am not miserable and am not in "the hit it long " brigade.
You have your opinion I have mine. I do feel we should mix our tactics up during the game as we are too predictable.
I prefer to be cautious rather than bull up the team to be something they are not. On our day we are a good team but to make us out to be the best in the division like some do on here is frankly embarrassing.

 

[Wexford Green]

Looking on the bright side I remember the 1985-86 promotion season under Dave Smith. We had come off an unbeaten 10 game stretch (including 9 wins in that run) before coming unstuck 3-0 at Wigan. It was a dog of a day in the rain on that grassy bank away end at Springfield Park. We were hammered, but in the 3 games after we won 4-1, 3-1 and 4-0. The latter was the promotion clinching victory against Bristol City. Keep the faith :scarf:

 

[GreenThing]

Mansfield is a great example. Lowe said they probably have the best front three in the league. Fortunately they were miss firing when we played them. But you could see the quality. So if we had set up with a pragmatic approach. Which is football speak for setting up with a more defensive approach to contain the opposition. Would we have won that game? I'm not convinced we would. It's very possible we could have sat in out own halve and ventured forward in limited numbers. Nothing wrong in that but we won that game by prioritising attack over defense. We risked conceding by playing brave football and were rewarded by notching up three valuable points. It has served us pretty well and it's exciting to watch. If you need binary football where more emphasis is on the defensive side of the game ( what we have done for as long as I can remember) maybe a strategic game like chess would be more up your street. :greensmile: I love what we are doing. Hate the losses but come on, every team in the country looses. Well except one.

Exactly. Risk loosing by playing to win rather than trying to secure a draw and hope for a breakaway goal. If you win half and loose half of your games you end up with 69pts, draw all of them and you end up with 46pts.

 

[memory man]

There is a post on the "Just back" thread where Leon the Green (I think) quotes a home supporter from last Saturday. The guy explains that Colchester had a wonder day and that with a bit of good fortune and more care we could have been level at half-time. Being a Colchester fan he obviously completely dispassionate about our performance but there are always three aspects to every story; your side, the other side and somewhere in the middle sits the truth. I think the Colchester man's post confirms the theory.

 

[Devongreenowl]

Bit like when we blitzed Orient in the first half. Everything we touched seemed to end in a goal. They weren’t that bad a side either