AFT statement on HHP development and **new update 19th Sept*

[esmer]

This is all a bit naive by the AFT. The loss of HHP was the price we paid for survival, people have short memories. Five years ago we were £17 million in debt which had to be somehow repaid if we were to survive.The loss of HHP and it's subsequent development by Akkeron was always part of the survival package. It's all too convenient to forget that now. The vet's site were the offices are proposed isn't, and never was, anything to do with the football club, beyond any planning difficulties which may delay the grandstand refurbishment. However we have been waiting years now so a small delay isn't the end of the world and if Akkeron are paying the professional fees for the whole scheme it is quite reasonable for them to submit one application.
Although the capacity issue is far from satisfactory it is the best we are going to get and the key is that there is a straightforward, realistic expansion plan to bring the capacity up to 20k.
The AFT are misguided and there is no logic whatsoever in them trying to block the development

 

[Baby Face Johnson]

Other than a Car Park, I've not seen any suggestion of what develpment there would benefit the Club. It's private land with a planning application on it.

Depending on your point of view, you have the right to support or object via the system as you desire. It bugs me if people are objecting and trying to stop it as part of some sort of agenda / vendetta or revenge against somebody just because 'they can'. It detracts from and dilutes the opinions of genuine objectors. Nothing worse than your beliefs being used as a football in someones petty games.

I'm not sure what the ACV applies to. Is it the actual bricks and mortar or the institution that is PAFC ? Hopfully not the former as everytime I've ever been in the Grandstand it smelt of damp wood. Get rid as soon as I say.

The suggestion of the Grandstand being hemmed in makes me smile a bit as, although I'm no expert on Grandstand building, I think it would be one heck of large one to need its footprint to spread as far back as the slowly disintegrating portakabins there now. Assuming the long term plan isnt to rival the Camp Nou !

Never joined the AFT because it gives the impression of being slightly disorganised and reading these threads, a little undemocratic in it's decision on 'policy' . A vehicle for a small group of people perhaps ? Much the same as any other group claiming to represent the 'Fanbase'.

Personally, I'd rather not see the extra office accommodation if it's not being utilised by the Club, I'd rather the sporting element and lifestyle theme of the area be maintained, but, the Ice Rink probably wont pay for itself and the develpors costs will want to be recouped.

Have you seen the latest SKETCH MASTERPLAN. Allowing for circulation space and matchday security control area. I doubt if the grandstand footprint could alter at all.

 

[IJN]

Well, hopefully I'm not a usual name but with solely my Argyle fan hat on,

No you're not BFJ, and you know it.

Everyone has their right to speak on here, but when the dirty tricks start and the PASOTI knocking start, I bite back.

Tony comes on here last night making accusations when a thread a couple of days old (and on the second page) is merged with an update. Usual stuff, stifling opinion etc, when everyone knows how the Mods work to keep this site tidy. There's nothing worse than different threads on the self same subject cropping up. Just because Tony think it's a new subject (when he himself put the word 'update; on his original thread, doesn't make it right. I know they think the AFT and what "they" say (the same old names again) will not change the way this site is run.

When PAFC attempt to tell us what we should be doing (which has happened) we tell them to do one, and exactly the same for the AFT.

Then we get:-

Yes.

The reason is that you dared to question "Sir Brent".

That is frowned upon here.

Right after Tony posted, people may lead to think, 'hang on perhaps PASOTI does cow down to JB'.

Problems is "Green Dogg" has the same name surname as the Chairman of the AFT, you can surely see why Site Admin (and I) get miffed. This is somewhat typical of what this site has to put up with on a regular basis.

Then add the fact that after I posted what I did after "Green Dogg" someone sends me a screen shot of something that was said on the 'Mother ship" (ATD/FreeChat) earlier that day and anyone who cares can see the orchestrated attempt of a few to destabilise the many.

It went (verbatim) like this:-

Keep Brent in check lad, pull him and his cronies at every opportunity. Honesty and transparency was what he promised when he took over, yet there's a lot of clock and dagger stuff at this moment in time'.

'Transparency'? "Cloak and Dagger" - :funny: You couldn't make it up. You tell me who's being 'honest' you tell me who's g :funny: guilty of 'cloak and dagger'?

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, everyone can post what they want on this site within the law (blah, blah, blah)but please don't believe all you read. A few people making an awful lot of noise does NOT represent Argyle fans it represents a few.

 

[Fat_green_belly]

Well, hopefully I'm not a usual name but with solely my Argyle fan hat on, I cannot see how anything on the HHP land will benefit Argyle in any way. In fact, it will hem in any future grandstand development, as many have already pointed out. I can see a benefit in the hotel making the conferencing more of an attractive option but the rest, no, not really.

As the grandstand refurb is already funded and not dependant upon any of the rest of the development, I cannot see why any Argyle fan would be in favour of the HHP development, at all, when all this could go elsewhere in the City (is additional office space even needed?), especially as it could put back the start of the refurb, either costing Argyle more or resulting in further cost reducton exercises on the scheme.

That may be a tad selfish, as there is an argument for Mr Brent to be able to generate a bit of profit on all the time he has invested in the club but from solely a selfish Argyle point of view, I just can't accept it all.

Well i dont look at it from purely an argyle point of view. I support plymouth argyle.
Thats the club and the city. Credit for using the word selfish. I can understand in a way.
We all want whats best for the club. But central park should benefit all the people of plymouth
not just us lucky few who follow argyle.
As for the stand well we must be doubling the width or more in the refurb so i dont see why that
extra width couldnt harbour a 2/3 tier stand.
The previous development would have hemmed us in for sure. Not so much now and the demport could
be expanded also.
Of course mr oligarch might want to relocate us elsewhere like ernesettle. Hmm. Perhaps not.

 

[Lousy Pint]

Can I safely assume that JB and the Board realise that the views of the AFT are those of a very small minority of Argyle fans?

 

[gaspargomez]

The area being developed is hardly parkland, a piece of rough ground, run down portakabins and an existing kennels and building, situated between car parks and the Life Centre.

Areas of hardstanding and very modest buildings. It allows open views and forms the setting of the park.

Brent wants to turn it into Gotham City !

 

[IJN]

Holy Cow Batman, 'tall buildings instead of single storey'!

Meanwhile in Exeter, the citizens are getting read for Ikea.

 

[jimsing]

The area being developed is hardly parkland, a piece of rough ground, run down portakabins and an existing kennels and building, situated between car parks and the Life Centre.

Areas of hardstanding and very modest buildings. It allows open views and forms the setting of the park.

Brent wants to turn it into Gotham City !

What an utterly trite remark to make.

 

[gaspargomez]

Can I safely assume that JB and the Board realise that the views of the AFT are those of a very small minority of Argyle fans?

Well I never heard of the AFT until today and I don't support the development either.

But what I would say is that Argyle fans (like myself) form a small minority of Plymouth residents. Its their city too !

There's a way forward to keep everyone happy- this scheme isn't the one I don't think. Let Brent come back with something more reasonable.

 

[IJN]

But what I would say is that Argyle fans (like myself) form a small minority of Plymouth residents. Its their city too !

Completely agree with that.

The council meeting will be interesting.

I might organise a coach. :scarf:

 

[Guiri Green]

The area being developed is hardly parkland, a piece of rough ground, run down portakabins and an existing kennels and building, situated between car parks and the Life Centre.

Areas of hardstanding and very modest buildings. It allows open views and forms the setting of the park.

Brent wants to turn it into Gotham City !

Well there's certainly plenty of Jokers about !

 

[Baby Face Johnson]

Well, hopefully I'm not a usual name but with solely my Argyle fan hat on, I cannot see how anything on the HHP land will benefit Argyle in any way. In fact, it will hem in any future grandstand development, as many have already pointed out. I can see a benefit in the hotel making the conferencing more of an attractive option but the rest, no, not really.

As the grandstand refurb is already funded and not dependant upon any of the rest of the development, I cannot see why any Argyle fan would be in favour of the HHP development, at all, when all this could go elsewhere in the City (is additional office space even needed?), especially as it could put back the start of the refurb, either costing Argyle more or resulting in further cost reducton exercises on the scheme.

That may be a tad selfish, as there is an argument for Mr Brent to be able to generate a bit of profit on all the time he has invested in the club but from solely a selfish Argyle point of view, I just can't accept it all.

Well i dont look at it from purely an argyle point of view. I support plymouth argyle.
Thats the club and the city. Credit for using the word selfish. I can understand in a way.
We all want whats best for the club. But central park should benefit all the people of plymouth
not just us lucky few who follow argyle.
As for the stand well we must be doubling the width or more in the refurb so i dont see why that
extra width couldnt harbour a 2/3 tier stand.
The previous development would have hemmed us in for sure. Not so much now and the demport could
be expanded also.
Of course mr oligarch might want to relocate us elsewhere like ernesettle. Hmm. Perhaps not.

Some fair points there. To clarify. I have no real problem with development in Plymouth, or in general, just not so close to the stand! Shift it all elsewhere and I'd have no real issues. Secondly, I hadn't considered that the grandstand refurb was significantly increasing the existing footprint. If it is then not so much of a problem but it doesn't look much different to me (certainly nowhere near doubling, as far as I can see).

*Oh and apart from the issue of the hybrid application putting a spanner in the works.

 

[Fat_green_belly]

The area being developed is hardly parkland, a piece of rough ground, run down portakabins and an existing kennels and building, situated between car parks and the Life Centre.

Areas of hardstanding and very modest buildings. It allows open views and forms the setting of the park.

Brent wants to turn it into Gotham City !

Hardstanding? As in a car park. Very modest buildings? What like that effing great warehouse of a life centre
and big football stadium? Open views with gilbert lane in situ?
Gotham city? Batman and robin v joker and penguin(he,d be well at home) at ice hockey.
The mind boggles.

 

[IJN]

Hands up, who votes that we all complain about the car parking even though PCC and the police don't want any.

Right then we have a City to save.

 

[Fat_green_belly]

Well, hopefully I'm not a usual name but with solely my Argyle fan hat on, I cannot see how anything on the HHP land will benefit Argyle in any way. In fact, it will hem in any future grandstand development, as many have already pointed out. I can see a benefit in the hotel making the conferencing more of an attractive option but the rest, no, not really.

As the grandstand refurb is already funded and not dependant upon any of the rest of the development, I cannot see why any Argyle fan would be in favour of the HHP development, at all, when all this could go elsewhere in the City (is additional office space even needed?), especially as it could put back the start of the refurb, either costing Argyle more or resulting in further cost reducton exercises on the scheme.

That may be a tad selfish, as there is an argument for Mr Brent to be able to generate a bit of profit on all the time he has invested in the club but from solely a selfish Argyle point of view, I just can't accept it all.

Well i dont look at it from purely an argyle point of view. I support plymouth argyle.
Thats the club and the city. Credit for using the word selfish. I can understand in a way.
We all want whats best for the club. But central park should benefit all the people of plymouth
not just us lucky few who follow argyle.
As for the stand well we must be doubling the width or more in the refurb so i dont see why that
extra width couldnt harbour a 2/3 tier stand.
The previous development would have hemmed us in for sure. Not so much now and the demport could
be expanded also.
Of course mr oligarch might want to relocate us elsewhere like ernesettle. Hmm. Perhaps not.

Some fair points there. To clarify. I have no real problem with development in Plymouth, or in general, just not so close to the stand! Shift it all elsewhere and I'd have no real issues. Secondly, I hadn't considered that the grandstand refurb was significantly increasing the existing footprint. If it is then not so much of a problem but it doesn't look much different to me (certainly nowhere near doubling, as far as I can see).

*Oh and apart from the issue of the hybrid application putting a spanner in the works.

Fair enough im only guessing from memory tbh. I am including the terracing width
in front as well as the extension to come aprox in width at the back as the doubling.
Next game i will have a closer look. Need to see and not guess.
As for the hybrid messing up argyle i would hope and expect the board/chairman at some point to act to prevent.
The 6 month highway england delay is not what it seems as i posted earlier.