Orient v Argyle match thread

[Green Manc]

Lowe brought Nouble on for Telford to get the ball to stick up top based on the hype a good decision, unfortunately I've not seen anything stick to Frank yet ! His control is crap he doesnt win headers. Yes hes a big lump but a fit Ryan Taylor is an upgrade on Frank in my opinion. A fit Ryan Taylor was always the issue for Argule though in fact a fit Ryan Brunt top trumps Frank as well ! Not even mentioning Trigger in the same breath !!

I'd agree with this, whilst Telford missed a couple of chances his control is good and he brings other players into the game. The other important thing that he and Hardie did was chase down defenders and give them no time on the ball, Nouble just stood there and allowed Orient time to build from the back, so we came under massive pressure as soon as he came on.
As for the comment he had a good effort on goal, he clearly tried to control the ball and his touch as ever was so bad it ended up looking like a shot.

 

[Balham Green]

Lowe brought Nouble on for Telford to get the ball to stick up top based on the hype a good decision, unfortunately I've not seen anything stick to Frank yet ! His control is crap he doesnt win headers. Yes hes a big lump but a fit Ryan Taylor is an upgrade on Frank in my opinion. A fit Ryan Taylor was always the issue for Argule though in fact a fit Ryan Brunt top trumps Frank as well ! Not even mentioning Trigger in the same breath !!

I'd agree with this, whilst Telford missed a couple of chances his control is good and he brings other players into the game. The other important thing that he and Hardie did was chase down defenders and give them no time on the ball, Nouble just stood there and allowed Orient time to build from the back, so we came under massive pressure as soon as he came on.
As for the comment he had a good effort on goal, he clearly tried to control the ball and his touch as ever was so bad it ended up looking like a shot.

And he kept getting caught offside. Think you got that one wrong Ryan! Certainly not a target man..

 

[mervyn]

Just two points to add. Firstly I’ve never seen a double nutmeg before. Very impressive. Secondly the criticism of Nouble’s heading and hold up play. Given that he barely received more than one or two passes after coming on, how can he be culpable? All credit to Orient for not giving up. Would be nice if we show similar character, as we did after the 4-0 City defeat.

 

[Bristol Rich]

LOL same old reaction to Argyle losing a game, from the 'experts' pundits.

One poor half of football and the world collapses - we are in for a topsy turvey season - the system Lowe plays isn't good.

What a load of tosh.

Get over it and move on. We lost a game of football, we will lose other games, it is in the nature of a sport, you win you lose, just like in life.

Yeah it is really crap not playing Spurs next week, but I am sure we will be okay and survive, not playing the Spurs U21 side.

:scarf:

By expert pundits do you mean anyone who doesn't just wave their scarf and shout Green Army blindly? It's a forum for opinions not unquestioning propaganda.

By the way there is every chance Jose in his desire to win a trophy will play a strong side in this competition. Even if he doesn't the point is Lowe has rightly tried to win his game by playing a strong side and we threw away a 2 goal lead to a team 1 league below. Who we were playing in the nest round is irrelevant to that point.

 

[Graham Clark]

Whilst it is early days admittedly in the three competitive games we've played (QPR, Blackpool and Orient) the opposition have had a total of 57 shots at goal (24 on target) - that is 19 shots per game. Argyle have managed 42 shots (16 on target). Our average last season was 14 shots on target for and 13 against.

It may be coincidence but the three teams have played 4-3-3 with a high press on our back three and despite having watched all three games through the narrow prism of the single iFollow camera there have been a number of occasions in all three games where the ball has been played behind our wing backs leaving either Aimson or Watts overloaded. Committed defence as against Blackpool , where our shot blocking was superb, will get you results but less resolute defending as was on show time and time again against Orient will not.

Once the opposition get to grips with Mayor as Orient did second half all our creativity and pace in attack seems to dissipate if not disappear. Playing with advanced wing backs is fine but a misplaced pass or a dispossession leaves us extremely vulnerable to a swift counter attack in the wide areas (witness Orient's third goal although assisted by Wooton's wretched mistake).

Ryan Lowe did tinker with a 3-1-4-2 last season as a variant to his favoured option. I wonder if Macleod or Grant could play there to drop into the back line if Aimson or Watts have to push wide to cover a counter attack on the flanks. Something needs to change as the first three games have demonstrated that we are far too open and vulnerable to a counter attack and on the evidence so far we will lose more games than we will win if we allow the number of shots on goal we have already each game. Of course if Telford has not screwed his shot wide at 2-0 it may have been a different result but the essential point remains.

 

[WoodsyGreen]

Interesting stat, Graham, and certainly one that should raise a worrying red flag among all Argyle fans (even those burying their heads in the sand this morning). Despite myself, I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt for now and put it down to the fact we're essentially playing a brand new defensive unit.

The back three have never played together before. One of them has barely any first-team football under his belt while another was out injured almost all of last season and the man in the middle is a mistake-prone ball watcher. The keeper is a rookie learning his trade and is far from being the finished article - he looks vulnerable in the air to me. At LWB, G Cooper was absent for our entire pre-season so will have missed a lot of work on the training ground, and we've not played the same RWB in successive games yet. Our CDM is also new and learning the system.

Let's hope last night was just a bit of rustiness while they all get used to each other, because if that was a sign of things to come then we're in for a very long season. Fans will expect a response on Saturday and we'd better get one.

 

[Tugboat]

I’d like to see a diamond midfield 4 at the expense of the second striker.

Macleod playing deep midfield. Camara and Grant in central midfield and cooper or mayor playing the ACM position.

Hardie upfront on his own making runs bringing the CAM into play supported the wingbacks.

 

[briangreen]

I’d like to see a diamond midfield 4 at the expense of the second striker.

Macleod playing deep midfield. Camara and Grant in central midfield and cooper or mayor playing the ACM position.

Hardie upfront on his own making runs bringing the CAM into play supported the wingbacks.

And Jephcott...

 

[Balham Green]

Interesting stat, Graham, and certainly one that should raise a worrying red flag among all Argyle fans (even those burying their heads in the sand this morning). Despite myself, I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt for now and put it down to the fact we're essentially playing a brand new defensive unit.

The back three have never played together before. One of them has barely any first-team football under his belt while another was out injured almost all of last season and the man in the middle is a mistake-prone ball watcher. The keeper is a rookie learning his trade and is far from being the finished article - he looks vulnerable in the air to me. At LWB, G Cooper was absent for our entire pre-season so will have missed a lot of work on the training ground, and we've not played the same RWB in successive games yet. Our CDM is also new and learning the system.

Let's hope last night was just a bit of rustiness while they all get used to each other, because if that was a sign of things to come then we're in for a very long season. Fans will expect a response on Saturday and we'd better get one.

Excellent post by Graham alluding to the system rather than the personnel. Unfortunately I think its both! All the things Woodsy said re the defenders are true and wont disappear. Watts looks like a player who played for Stevenage last season. The keeper cannot deal with crosses. At fault for first goal when he punched. Very harsh to blame him for the other 2 when he was completely exposed.
You learn more from defeats than victories. Disappointing to miss out on Spurs which would have been fun but not the end of the world. The bigger picture was the inadequacies shown up by a lower League side. To me its a team with a soft centre. Inexperienced keeper, no ball winner in CM in the Songo'o role and no target man. Without resolving those issues could be a long season.

 

[Argylegames]

At fault for first goal when he punched.

He has to have that coached out of him very very quickly.

 

[ealinggreen]

An awful lot of poor defending happened after the punch. It may not have been the greatest punch but I have seen a lot of top class goalkeepers punch that type of cross..

 

[arrythewurzel]

We do look a bit exposed defensively and I think we would be improved if Bakinson came back or someone of his physique and ability. Perhaps Lowe is still in the market for such a player as he was interested in getting Backinsom back but all went quiet. We’re still work in progress with quite a few changes to lineups and new personnel slotting in so not overly concerned apart from goals shipped.

Bit early to be deciding ... but it feels a weaker squad than last year without Bakinson Sarce McFadzean and Palmer. Feels a bit more lightweight to me. Time will tell.

 

[Knibbsworth]

If it hadn't have been a clean catch, if Cooper spilled it just momentarily and one of the players crowding him had tapped it in, I am sure Cooper would have criticised by the same posters for not punching it.

The most worrying thing is Watts's positioning for the second goal. He didn't seem to have a clue where his man was.

He is a young lad but I don't think he looks an upgrade on Sawyer or Canavan yet. Maybe he will grow with fitness and experience, but I hope Lowe is not guilty of assuming a loan from a bigger club automatically means better quality.

 

[Daz]

Can’t put any blame on Cooper for their first goal. Hatfield has a good opportunity to clear but scuffed the clearance. As someone else said, lots of bad defending after the punch.

 

[HC Green]

At fault for first goal when he punched.

He has to have that coached out of him very very quickly.

Cooper has been at Argyle since the age of nine, training with the same coach for almost all that time.
Perhaps he has been coached to punch to compensate for his height?