Next AFT meeting with Martyn Starnes on 21st March | Page 4 | PASOTI
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Next AFT meeting with Martyn Starnes on 21st March

Jan 31, 2005
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Ha, yeh you're right LG.

That said, I think the issue is a 'macro' one, not a micro-level AFT-specific one.

Purely from my perspective, my view is that the current Board have engaged with the fans far more often than any of its predecessors. In chief, this engagement has been well received; particularly so when when undertaken on an informal basis.

Formal engagement has proved more problematic. The PASB was something instigated - & wanted - by the Board. It was never going to be exciting ~ it was there primarily for the formal, governancy-stuff of a company wanting to work closely with its stakeholders; in this case us, the fans.

The PASB's near-complete lack of success was down to a number of factors; but I have no doubt that the primary reason for its collapse was that the conscious attempts to undermine it by some led to mistrust from the Club, which led to...... well, you get the story. A shame really, as there was an excellent nucleus on the PASB that, whilst not always in agreement, had the skill set to make it work. As for the small number of others, some big egos trapped inside small minds I'm afraid.

Again from my perspective ~ & with absolutely no insider knowledge ~ it seems to me that under its new leadership, the AFT are taking a more mature, measured approach to its formal relationship with the Club. But there are challenges associated with this more measured approach, & it's these same challenges that the PASB faced.

The handling ~ & disclosure ~ of sensitive information, 'turn-around' times, the amount of time required of the volunteers, etc, etc.

As for the 'turn-around' times of minutes in particular, this was a particular bête noir for the PASB & appears to be the same for the AFT. Of course, standard protocol for meetings at the top of companies & organisations usually sees minutes being signed off at the following meeting prior to wider circulation. Yet here, pressure from a vocal ~ & largely uninvolved & inexpert ~ minority seeks a different, quicker approach. It did so with the PASB & is now doing so with the AFT.

If acceded to, this pressure can in turn generate conflict between the two parties who are actually trying to achieve something, which of course in turn results in little, or nothing, being achieved. I think that this needs to be resisted.

For me, people tend to be either drains or radiators. Perhaps it's time for the drains ~ or as LG calls them, the snipers ~ to put up or shut up.

If you don't want to to try & achieve something then fine, but why take pot shots at others who are trying to actively support Plymouth Argyle?

I'm content with the AFT's more measured, mature approach. As for the minutes, if I were they I'd agree the circulation of minutes after agreement at the following meeting (unless specific urgency dictated otherwise) & try & ignore the resultant smell from the drains.

Always work to the objective, not the methodology.

Proper isn't always popular.
 

L G

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Feb 25, 2005
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JonB":250k9lgq said:
Ha, yeh you're right LG.

That said, I think the issue is a 'macro' one, not a micro-level AFT-specific one.

Purely from my perspective, my view is that the current Board have engaged with the fans far more often than any of its predecessors. In chief, this engagement has been well received; particularly so when when undertaken on an informal basis.

Formal engagement has proved more problematic. The PASB was something instigated - & wanted - by the Board. It was never going to be exciting ~ it was there primarily for the formal, governancy-stuff of a company wanting to work closely with its stakeholders; in this case us, the fans.

The PASB's near-complete lack of success was down to a number of factors; but I have no doubt that the primary reason for its collapse was that the conscious attempts to undermine it by some led to mistrust from the Club, which led to...... well, you get the story. A shame really, as there was an excellent nucleus on the PASB that, whilst not always in agreement, had the skill set to make it work. As for the small number of others, some big egos trapped inside small minds I'm afraid.

Again from my perspective ~ & with absolutely no insider knowledge ~ it seems to me that under its new leadership, the AFT are taking a more mature, measured approach to its formal relationship with the Club. But there are challenges associated with this more measured approach, & it's these same challenges that the PASB faced.

The handling ~ & disclosure ~ of sensitive information, 'turn-around' times, the amount of time required of the volunteers, etc, etc.

As for the 'turn-around' times of minutes in particular, this was a particular bête noir for the PASB & appears to be the same for the AFT. Of course, standard protocol for meetings at the top of companies & organisations usually sees minutes being signed off at the following meeting prior to wider circulation. Yet here, pressure from a vocal ~ & largely uninvolved & inexpert ~ minority seeks a different, quicker approach. It did so with the PASB & is now doing so with the AFT.

If acceded to, this pressure can in turn generate conflict between the two parties who are actually trying to achieve something, which of course in turn results in little, or nothing, being achieved. I think that this needs to be resisted.

For me, people tend to be either drains or radiators. Perhaps it's time for the drains ~ or as LG calls them, the snipers ~ to put up or shut up.

If you don't want to to try & achieve something then fine, but why take pot shots at others who are trying to actively support Plymouth Argyle?

I'm content with the AFT's more measured, mature approach. As for the minutes, if I were they I'd agree the circulation of minutes after agreement at the following meeting (unless specific urgency dictated otherwise) & try & ignore the resultant smell from the drains.

Always work to the objective, not the methodology.

Proper isn't always popular.
Jon
yesterday, James and I spent a couple of hours at the Wolves Museum, which is part of their new stand which is housed behind one of the goals.
Well worth a visit for anyone who loves football if you're ever in that area.
And that's even with the £7 entrance fee for getting in.
There were lots of interactive things for young and old alike.
We even recorded an interview with John Motson celebrating a derby win, where I resigned the job as I was going to a bigger and better job at Plymouth Argyle :lol: (don't think that will get on their fan wall).
And don't get me started on the 'Marillion family' V's the 'Green Army family'.
This club could be so much better if we all pulled together.
Alas I feel that there are too many egos involved and people are entrenched in their opinions and views on 'personalities' that we'll forever be one of the also rans.
 
Dec 21, 2010
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Thank you for your measured response JonB. While not the secretary, I am happy to answer any queries here or on my latest post. Bob Foale
 

dunlop

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argyledad":16zs7gbb said:
Thank you for your measured response JonB. While not the secretary, I am happy to answer any queries here or on my latest post. Bob Foale

Are you agreeing with JonB ( Mr Corporate Governance) that the previous AFT committee did not act in a mature way when dealing with the main board.
 

IJN

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Mike, as much as the previous Chairman irked me, is there any point to this now.

The new board is in place, there's some decent people on the top table and even more working behind the scenes, what's the point of your poking?

Move on I say.
 
From afar, I see the new AFT Board are really setting the world alight with their meetings with the CEO !!

Concerns over the "Far Post Club" ?

Really important issues.

Suggest that the Argyle Directors, yet again, are simply paying lip service to another newly-formatted "fans" organisation - representative of whom ?

Numerically, a smallish fraction of the regular following ?

And why should PAFC answer crucial, demanding and relevant questions of a private company ?

Its James Brent's toy and he does not want - seemingly - to divulge any appropriate information related to important issues.

The Far Post Club - not important to the masses, only to a handful of......................!!!

When Jams Brent has departed and the new owners taken over, what will change ?

Absolutely nothing ..................and why should it ?

Football fans have this misplaced and misappropriated feeling that their Club belongs to them :facepalm:

Move on...............nothing to see here.

Keep the Faith :scarf:
 

dunlop

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IJN":tkvjee15 said:
Mike, as much as the previous Chairman irked me, is there any point to this now.

The new board is in place, there's some decent people on the top table and even more working behind the scenes, what's the point of your poking?

Move on I say.

Ian I never raised the issue of the previous board it was Jon B, I don't have an issue with the current or the old AFT board all I am asking is for members to be brought up to date with minutes of the last meeting with Martin Starnes.
 
Dec 21, 2010
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The minutes have now been posted Dunlop and I apologise for the delay. I cannot comment on the previous chair as I never served under him. What I do think is that Fans' Trusts CAN play a vital role in supporting their clubs. Exeter have done very well this season considering they are run by a Fans' Trust with no sugar daddy. Meanwhile Torquay's Fans' Trust has received a lot of positive coverage in the last week. With a thousand paid up members the AFT I would suggest represents quite a high proportion of regular fans. One in every 6 or 7 in fact, which ain't bad in my opinion.
 

tonycholwell

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argyledad":cflrk6rc said:
The minutes have now been posted Dunlop and I apologise for the delay. I cannot comment on the previous chair as I never served under him. What I do think is that Fans' Trusts CAN play a vital role in supporting their clubs. Exeter have done very well this season considering they are run by a Fans' Trust with no sugar daddy. Meanwhile Torquay's Fans' Trust has received a lot of positive coverage in the last week. With a thousand paid up members the AFT I would suggest represents quite a high proportion of regular fans. One in every 6 or 7 in fact, which ain't bad in my opinion.

Dear Argyledad

I hate to tell you but the minutes of your meeting with Martyn in March are not on your website.

The last meeting reported was on the 7th March, an internal meeting where you reported (nearly) a thousand members including 140 juniors, who I think don't pay.

It is to your credit then that you have boosted membership in under a month to, as you say above, 1000 paid up members, from the (approximately) 850 you had on the 7th. Or have I misread something somewhere?
 

dunlop

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argyledad":2yr6sbds said:
The minutes have now been posted Dunlop and I apologise for the delay. I cannot comment on the previous chair as I never served under him. What I do think is that Fans' Trusts CAN play a vital role in supporting their clubs. Exeter have done very well this season considering they are run by a Fans' Trust with no sugar daddy. Meanwhile Torquay's Fans' Trust has received a lot of positive coverage in the last week. With a thousand paid up members the AFT I would suggest represents quite a high proportion of regular fans. One in every 6 or 7 in fact, which ain't bad in my opinion.


I have not commented on the previous chair it was your endorsement of JonB comment that the new AFT board would act in a more mature way was my query.

As The post above I can't see any minutes on the website.
 

memory man

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tonycholwell":3vlhjuah said:
argyledad":3vlhjuah said:
The minutes have now been posted Dunlop and I apologise for the delay. I cannot comment on the previous chair as I never served under him. What I do think is that Fans' Trusts CAN play a vital role in supporting their clubs. Exeter have done very well this season considering they are run by a Fans' Trust with no sugar daddy. Meanwhile Torquay's Fans' Trust has received a lot of positive coverage in the last week. With a thousand paid up members the AFT I would suggest represents quite a high proportion of regular fans. One in every 6 or 7 in fact, which ain't bad in my opinion.

Dear Argyledad

I hate to tell you but the minutes of your meeting with Martyn in March are not on your website.

The last meeting reported was on the 7th March, an internal meeting where you reported (nearly) a thousand members including 140 juniors, who I think don't pay.

It is to your credit then that you have boosted membership in under a month to, as you say above, 1000 paid up members, from the (approximately) 850 you had on the 7th. Or have I misread something somewhere?
I don't think I have ever seen "I hate to" written with such glee.
 
Aug 21, 2008
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Plymouth
memory man":1hxif6pt said:
tonycholwell":1hxif6pt said:
argyledad":1hxif6pt said:
The minutes have now been posted Dunlop and I apologise for the delay. I cannot comment on the previous chair as I never served under him. What I do think is that Fans' Trusts CAN play a vital role in supporting their clubs. Exeter have done very well this season considering they are run by a Fans' Trust with no sugar daddy. Meanwhile Torquay's Fans' Trust has received a lot of positive coverage in the last week. With a thousand paid up members the AFT I would suggest represents quite a high proportion of regular fans. One in every 6 or 7 in fact, which ain't bad in my opinion.

Dear Argyledad

I hate to tell you but the minutes of your meeting with Martyn in March are not on your website.

The last meeting reported was on the 7th March, an internal meeting where you reported (nearly) a thousand members including 140 juniors, who I think don't pay.

It is to your credit then that you have boosted membership in under a month to, as you say above, 1000 paid up members, from the (approximately) 850 you had on the 7th. Or have I misread something somewhere?
I don't think I have ever seen "I hate to" written with such glee.

But Tony is spot on - as far as I can tell the minutes have still not been "posted", certainly not on the AFT website.

As a Trust member (1593) I would be interested to see them.