B
Baby Face Johnson
Guest
Very poorly thought out when you get into the nuts and bolts of it. As i have not been to the Mayflower side for ages what has happened to the old access road into the old Mayflower Centre and HHP ?
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with-menace":3g3dls35 said:
Why 20,000 though?
Only eight games in the last 30 years have attracted gates of over 20,000.
17,500 will be enough for League 2, League 1 and the nPC but 20,000 will not be enough for the Prem.
The majority who are against this build are saying that 17,500 is too small for their ambitions for the club. Well if that is true, why are there no calls for 30,000?
If your ambition is the nPC then 17,500 will probably suffice. If your ambition is Premier League then it has to be 30,000.
22,000 - 25,000 is right in the middle of the deep blue sea. It seems to be more of an ego figure than an ambitions figure.[/quote]
Virtually no ones mentioned a 22,000-25,000 capacity, where are you getting this from?
By far the general consensus is for a 20,000 capacity.[/quote]
Why 20,000 though?
Only eight games in the last 30 years have attracted gates of over 20,000.
17,500 will be enough for League 2, League 1 and the nPC but 20,000 will not be enough for the Prem.[/quote]
That's wrong I'll give you an example 1986 Bristol city, official attendance 19,000, actually attendance 25-30,000 of those that did get 20,000 some were nearer 30,000 ie everton 'officially 28,0000 but probably nearer 35,000) Pompey officially 21,000 but more,derby officially 34,0000 but god knows how many we're actually there. And it goes on and on. The qpr game in league one had 40,0000 ticket inquiries. Of the sell outs in the ccc we probably would have sold 30,000 for west ham everton Leeds etc.
as for why 20,000? I've no idea what your on about ?
What do you want us to say 21,642?
Twenty thousand is the minimum realistic level most of us would be happy to except. I'd of thought that was painfully obvious if you've read any of the posts on the subject.
If your ambition is the nPC then 17,500 will probably suffice. If your ambition is Premier League then it has to be 30,000.
22,000 - 25,000 is right in the middle of the deep blue sea. It seems to be more of an ego figure than an ambitions figure.[/quote]
Virtually no ones mentioned a 22,000-25,000 capacity, where are you getting this from?
By far the general consensus is for a 20,000 capacity.[/quote]
Why 20,000 though?
Only eight games in the last 30 years have attracted gates of over 20,000.
17,500 will be enough for League 2, League 1 and the nPC but 20,000 will not be enough for the Prem.[/quote]
That's wrong I'll give you an example 1986 Bristol city, official attendance 19,000, actually attendance 25-30,000 of those that did get 20,000 some were nearer 30,000 ie everton 'officially 28,0000 but probably nearer 35,000) Pompey officially 21,000 but more,derby officially 34,0000 but god knows how many we're actually there. And it goes on and on. The qpr game in league one had 40,0000 ticket inquiries. Of the sell outs in the ccc we probably would have sold 30,000 for west ham everton Leeds etc.
as for why 20,000? I've no idea what your on about ?
What do you want us to say 21,642?
Twenty thousand is the minimum realistic level most of us would be happy to except. I'd of thought that was painfully obvious if you've read any of the posts on the subject.
Right, I've tried to stay off this site as posting on here can quickly get time consuming and take over too much of your life, but after reading through about 100 pages of crap about this new stand I'm now pi$$ed off and need to vent some fury.
Firstly, the attitude towards the trust from some posters, including shamefully mods, on this issue is an absolute disgrace. Responding to trust members highlighting points they're going to put forward with pathetic, unrelated, ad-hominen $hit-stirring rubbish to try and bring them down a peg looks absolutely pathetic. Now is the time for us to hold our board to account, not to engage in pathetic $hit stirring political games more reminiscent of a menopausal Women's Institute committee meeting than grown adults wanting the best for the club they love.
It is clearl that a vast majority on here are narked off with the proposals. So why slag off a fan-based body that is putting fan-concerns forward to the board? Contrast this with the difference in attitude towards the Supporters Board. Some Neville Chamberlain "peace in our time" messages appear on here that "WE'VE GOT THE SECOND TIER! HORRAY! LOOK WHAT CONSTRUCTIVE DISCUSSION CAN ACHIEVE". Pats on the back all around, until convenient silence when it turns out the second tier is just a Jewson South Western League stand welded on top of the existing $hit stand.
Then the loaded forum question amounting to "Would you rather have the new stand or no stand at all" could not be more loaded. Some people notice this, point it out, but are mocked. WHY is a question being loaded towards the interests of the board of directors rather than the interests of dissatisfied fans on an independent site?
Then there's just the absolute, abject incompetence coming from our board. I'd just about forgiven them for attempting to hire a director of football with all the business nous of a corner-shop hiring a paperboy, but the way this stand was presented to the fans... Jesus, what an absolute joke. Nobody expected this stand to happen any time in the immediate future, so a carefully planned stand that would please fans whilst achieving JB's business requirements could have been presented. Instead, we have a leaked etch-a-sketch that came from nowhere, followed by a plan that has alienated and pi$$ed off most of the fanbase, which leads to my next rant....
THE F**KING ICE RINK. F**K THE F**KING ICE RINK. This stand is the future of an ancient institution at the very heart of the City. Yes, the ice rink makes the project viable, but the very thought that a F**KING ICE RINK could hinder our development as a club, could TAKE PRIORITY over the interests of the club has made my blood boil.
JB clearly didn't set out to make me this angry, so it begs the question, who the hell is advising him on fan PR? Even if we eventually get the stand we want, this will make fans more distrusting of the board. If they went to the supporters board in the first place and put forward these plans, someone would have said "hey, James, some fans might be infuriated that an ice rink would take priority over future development". Then there's the cloak-and-dagger bullpoo that the stadium "can still be extended". Well if we all jumped up and down repeatedly, we could flatten the entire planet. Except it would take forever and wouldn't be viable. If JB's plan for the future of this club is "build a small grandstand that doesn't get in the way of my ice rink, then I guess we could tear down the whole Deveonport to rebuild it at an insane cost in the future if we have to" then I truly despair.
I sympathise that JB is in a difficult position. He needs to make the stadium viable, and has other interests that are competing with the club around the stadium. But te are not brainless simpletons. We all realise this. None of us are crying out for a stadium like the AMEX. A balance has to be struck. But by immediately trying to strike the balance so firmly against the club in favour of his outside interests, I have lost a huge amount of trust in the man. Then all this petulant "I'm not speaking to the trust anymore because they dared to tell the media they aren't happy with how rubbish the club is" crap. Message to the board of directors: GROW UP.
JB saved the club, was the owner I wanted, and is still the best owner available and so far, despite some abject incompetence coming from the top of the club, is trying to run the club in the right way, and has stumped up some of his own money to keep the club going. I hope my criticism isn't seen as too disrespectual, but if we have learned ANYTHING from the last three years it is to ASK BLOODY QUESTIONS of the people running the club, not roll over have our bellies tickled and mock people who do hold the club to account. I've never bothered joining the trust, but my application will be in the post and I'm glad that a supporters' body is holding the board to account, and hugely disappointed that the thin-skinned owners of the club can't seem to be able to deal with that. Boo hoo. Man up and do your bloody job.
And exhale....
Firstly, the attitude towards the trust from some posters, including shamefully mods, on this issue is an absolute disgrace. Responding to trust members highlighting points they're going to put forward with pathetic, unrelated, ad-hominen $hit-stirring rubbish to try and bring them down a peg looks absolutely pathetic. Now is the time for us to hold our board to account, not to engage in pathetic $hit stirring political games more reminiscent of a menopausal Women's Institute committee meeting than grown adults wanting the best for the club they love.
It is clearl that a vast majority on here are narked off with the proposals. So why slag off a fan-based body that is putting fan-concerns forward to the board? Contrast this with the difference in attitude towards the Supporters Board. Some Neville Chamberlain "peace in our time" messages appear on here that "WE'VE GOT THE SECOND TIER! HORRAY! LOOK WHAT CONSTRUCTIVE DISCUSSION CAN ACHIEVE". Pats on the back all around, until convenient silence when it turns out the second tier is just a Jewson South Western League stand welded on top of the existing $hit stand.
Then the loaded forum question amounting to "Would you rather have the new stand or no stand at all" could not be more loaded. Some people notice this, point it out, but are mocked. WHY is a question being loaded towards the interests of the board of directors rather than the interests of dissatisfied fans on an independent site?
Then there's just the absolute, abject incompetence coming from our board. I'd just about forgiven them for attempting to hire a director of football with all the business nous of a corner-shop hiring a paperboy, but the way this stand was presented to the fans... Jesus, what an absolute joke. Nobody expected this stand to happen any time in the immediate future, so a carefully planned stand that would please fans whilst achieving JB's business requirements could have been presented. Instead, we have a leaked etch-a-sketch that came from nowhere, followed by a plan that has alienated and pi$$ed off most of the fanbase, which leads to my next rant....
THE F**KING ICE RINK. F**K THE F**KING ICE RINK. This stand is the future of an ancient institution at the very heart of the City. Yes, the ice rink makes the project viable, but the very thought that a F**KING ICE RINK could hinder our development as a club, could TAKE PRIORITY over the interests of the club has made my blood boil.
JB clearly didn't set out to make me this angry, so it begs the question, who the hell is advising him on fan PR? Even if we eventually get the stand we want, this will make fans more distrusting of the board. If they went to the supporters board in the first place and put forward these plans, someone would have said "hey, James, some fans might be infuriated that an ice rink would take priority over future development". Then there's the cloak-and-dagger bullpoo that the stadium "can still be extended". Well if we all jumped up and down repeatedly, we could flatten the entire planet. Except it would take forever and wouldn't be viable. If JB's plan for the future of this club is "build a small grandstand that doesn't get in the way of my ice rink, then I guess we could tear down the whole Deveonport to rebuild it at an insane cost in the future if we have to" then I truly despair.
I sympathise that JB is in a difficult position. He needs to make the stadium viable, and has other interests that are competing with the club around the stadium. But te are not brainless simpletons. We all realise this. None of us are crying out for a stadium like the AMEX. A balance has to be struck. But by immediately trying to strike the balance so firmly against the club in favour of his outside interests, I have lost a huge amount of trust in the man. Then all this petulant "I'm not speaking to the trust anymore because they dared to tell the media they aren't happy with how rubbish the club is" crap. Message to the board of directors: GROW UP.
JB saved the club, was the owner I wanted, and is still the best owner available and so far, despite some abject incompetence coming from the top of the club, is trying to run the club in the right way, and has stumped up some of his own money to keep the club going. I hope my criticism isn't seen as too disrespectual, but if we have learned ANYTHING from the last three years it is to ASK BLOODY QUESTIONS of the people running the club, not roll over have our bellies tickled and mock people who do hold the club to account. I've never bothered joining the trust, but my application will be in the post and I'm glad that a supporters' body is holding the board to account, and hugely disappointed that the thin-skinned owners of the club can't seem to be able to deal with that. Boo hoo. Man up and do your bloody job.
And exhale....
Give that man a ceegar. Says it all for me too. I am non-plussed by the parking issue. Suppose it's a busy match day. Throw in a diving/swimming gala. Latest Harry Potter film is on. Skating rink busy. Hotel full. Where the hell do they all park? Cue planning application for Loves Field or Cottage Field. You have to suspect Brent will yield on certain ideas but he will still end up with far too much development.
B
bandwagon
Guest
Manchester Green":288k9o9c said:
That came straight from the heart, you can tell - well done that man!! :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
Without the Ice Rink and the Hotel there can be no new Grandstand though. JB is not paying for all this out of his back pocket. The money will be borrowed in the knowledge that the Ice Rink and the Hotel will return to those loaning the money, a full and profitable return.
With the current financial climate, banks and institutions will not loan to football clubs. It is therefore the whole development or none at all.
James Brent must be currently out of pocket with what he has put into Argyle. This development was always his plan to balance his books. It surely needs to happen in one form or another.
With the current financial climate, banks and institutions will not loan to football clubs. It is therefore the whole development or none at all.
James Brent must be currently out of pocket with what he has put into Argyle. This development was always his plan to balance his books. It surely needs to happen in one form or another.
N
NZGreen
Guest
Manchester Green":3b3yjkqu said:
Well said that man.
An excellent summary of those 100 pages of crap!
N
NZGreen
Guest
Lundan Cabbie":3dqg318y said:
Without the new grandstand there can be no ice rink or hotel. Pause for effect....and rest.....
Can I just get some clarity on one thing I keep reading and that I'm struggling to comprehend;
'The stand cannot be built higher than the life centre'
Is this true?
If so W T F?
WHY? Will the Life Centre spontaneously combust if the stand exceeds its height? Will all the water drain out of Tom Daley's paddling pool?
Can someone seriously tell me that quite apart from the Ice-rink (God how I've always wanted to go to an Ice Rink, can't think why I haven't done so yet in the 28 years I've been alive) the colossal two-fingers up at architecture that the Life Centre is is also a barrier to the development of the Grandstand!?
What authority is it that is setting this supposed ceiling on the height of the new stand? Did everyone know this when the Life Centre was in it's own planning stage?
How can a City blessed with a public canvas as big as Central Park make such an absolute pig's ear of developing it?!
AAAAAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHHH
'The stand cannot be built higher than the life centre'
Is this true?
If so W T F?
WHY? Will the Life Centre spontaneously combust if the stand exceeds its height? Will all the water drain out of Tom Daley's paddling pool?
Can someone seriously tell me that quite apart from the Ice-rink (God how I've always wanted to go to an Ice Rink, can't think why I haven't done so yet in the 28 years I've been alive) the colossal two-fingers up at architecture that the Life Centre is is also a barrier to the development of the Grandstand!?
What authority is it that is setting this supposed ceiling on the height of the new stand? Did everyone know this when the Life Centre was in it's own planning stage?
How can a City blessed with a public canvas as big as Central Park make such an absolute pig's ear of developing it?!
AAAAAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHHH
